B/X, BECMI and OSE Love Thread

[3rik]

Maybe I am misunderstanding. I thought he meant you don't pick a race and then a class, but you just pick a class that consists of a specific race and class.

 

[Necrozius]

Flipping through OSE (which I’m loving) I’m noticing a few small gaps. For example: costs for living expenses. I went to LotFP and found such a handy chart. I think that will be valuable until the PCs reach a level where they can make their own homes.

So I started flipping through Rules and Magic from LotFP and found a couple other things to carry over: black powder firearms and the Summon Spell.

Are there any specific, external resources that you like to borrow for your B/X game of choice?

 

[Weru]

Maybe it's a fever dream but I thought I remembered an OSE product with more race/class combos as classes. I can't find it on my hard drive or Drivethru library. I have the Advanced Fantasy Genre Rules with things like Acrobat and Assassin but I thought there was something with things like Dwarf Cleric. It might be OSE compatible by another publisher or for another retroclone.

Anyone know what I might have seen?

Could it have been ACKs? If I remember, that has some sort of class customisation built into the core rules. Not sure.

 

[Necrozius]

I would love to see the devils and demons statted up and laid out by the OSE people. Maybe in a future Carcass Crawler?

I have them in Advanced Labyrinth Lord but it’s just not the same.

 

[Moonglum]

There was some suggestion that they would appear in a forthcoming supplement that is having a kickstarter this fall, but now I'm confused because the more detailed description of that sounds like a separate game aimed at playing Stranger Things with the serial numbers filed off. Either those are two different things or we aren't really going to get devils and demons for OSE (or maybe they will provide them but with a 'stranger things' wrapper?).

 

[Necrozius]

Wow Infravision is different than later editions. All it allows you to do is see living things as heat signatures, not tactical night vision goggles. So it isn’t as great as I thought. Still useful, true. Enough that I would rather it stay with underdark races.

 

[Stan]

Wow Infravision is different than later editions. All it allows you to do is see living things as heat signatures, not tactical night vision goggles. So it isn’t as great as I thought. Still useful, true. Enough that I would rather it stay with underdark races.

Infravision is possibly more realistic for complete darkness. But it required more adjudication so they simplified it in darkvision.

 

[Chris Brady]

Here is a list of BECMI classes

​

Spoiler: Spoilered for length

Base Classes

Rules Cyclopedia
Cleric
Fighter
Magic-User
Thief
Druid
Mystic
Dwarf
Elf
Halfling

PC1 Tall Tales of the Wee Folk
Brownie/Redcap
Centaur
Dryad
Faun
Hsiao
Leprechaun
Pixie
Pooka
Sidhe
Sprite
Treant
Wood Imp
Wooddrake

PC2 Top Ballista
Faenare
Faenare Windsinger
Gnome, Sky
Gnome, Earth
Gremlin
Harpy
Nagpa
Pegataur
Sphinx
Tabi

PC3 The Sea Peoples
Nixie
Merrow
Aquatic Elf
Shark-kin
Triton Mage
Triton Cleric
Triton Cleric/Mage
Kna
Kopru
Sea Giant

Dragon Magazine
Elf Cleric
Elf Druid
Bard
N'djatwa
Shazak
Gurrash
Cayma
Chameleon Man
Aranea
Phanaton
E'eaar
Enduk

Dawn of the Emperors/Arena of Thyatis
Rake
Forester

GAZ2: Emirates of Ylaruam
Dervish

GAZ6: Dwarves of Rockhome
Dwarf Cleric

GAZ7: Northern Reaches
Wise Woman
Godi (Clerics of Thor, Odin, Loki and Hel)

GAZ10: Orcs of Thar
Goblin
Kobold
Hogboblin
Bugbear
Troll
Gnoll
Orc
Ogre

GAZ12: Golden Khan of Ethengar
Horse Warrior
Bratak
Hakomon
Ethengar Shaman

GAZ13: Shadow Elves
Shadow Elf Shaman

GAZ14: Atruaghin Clans
Atruaghin Shamani

Hollow World
Warrior Elf
Beastman
Brute-Man
Hutaakan
Krugel Orc
Kubbit
Malpheggi Lizard Man

HWR2: Kingdom of Nithia
Cleric of Horon
Cleric of Pflarr
Cleric of Ptahr
Cleric of Ranivorus
Cleric of Rathanos
Cleric of Thanatos
Cleric of Isiris
Fighter: Archer
Fighter: Charioteer
Fighter: Heavyman
Fighter: Spearman
Fighter: Runner
Fighter: Khopesh
Cleric: War Cleric
M-U: Mage-Scribe
M-U: Montoth
M-U: Templar
Thief: Royal Seal-Bearer
Thief: Lockmaster
Thief: Guardian

HWR3: Milenian Empire
Redhair (Cleric of Halav)
Midwife (Cleric of Vanya)
Mariner (Cleric of Protius)
Holy Defender (Cleric of Petra)
Griffon Rider

HWA3: Nightstorm
Kirtana Assassin

Wrath of the Immortals
Specialty Priest (for the following Immortals: Al-Kalim Alphaks, Alphatia, Asterius, Atruaghin, Atzanteotl, Benekander, Calitha, Diamond the Star Dragon, Diulanna, Djaea, Eiryndul, Faunus, Frey, Freyja, The Great One, Halav, Hel, Ilsundal, Ixion, Ka, Kagyar, Karaash, Khoronous, Korotiku, Koryis, Loki, Masauwu, Mealiden, Noumena, Nyx, Odin, Opal the Sun Dragon, Orcus, Ordana, Pearl the Moon Dragon, Petra, Pflarr, Protius, Rad, Rafiel, Rathanos, Razud, Talitha, Tarastia, Terra, Thanatos, Thor, Valerias, Vanya, Zirchev)

Champions of Mystara
Elf Shaman
Gruugraakh Gnoll

Rage of the Rakasta
Rakasta (only up to level 5)

Ral Partha D&D Basic Heroes Set
Rakasta (only up to level 5)



Races (can use any human class)

Dragon Magazine
Half-Elf
Lupin
Rakasta



Additional classes (can only be added to existing class or dual-classed into)

Rules Cyclopedia
Paladin
Avenger
Knight
Druid


PC1 Tall Tales of the Wee Folk
PC2 Top Ballista
Creature Wicca
Creature Shaman

PC3 The Sea People
Sea Wicca
Sea Shaman

PC4: The Night Howlers
Werebat
Werebear
Wereboar
Werefox
Wererat
Wereseal
Wereshark
Weretiger
Werewolf
Devil Swine

Dragon Magazine
Druidic Knight
Elf Paladin
Elf Druidic Knight

GAZ3: Principalities of Glantri
Elementalist
Alchemist
Illusionist
Necromancer
Cryptomancer
Witch/Warlock
Dracologist

GAZ5: Elves of Alfheim
Elf Wizard
Elf Treekeeper

GAZ8: The Five Shires
Hin Master

GAZ9: Minrothad Guilds
Sea Prince

GAZ10: Orcs of Thar
Goblinoid Wicca
Goblinoid Shaman

GAZ11: Republic of Darokin
Merchant

Hollow World
Shaman
Wokani


Human Classes

Cleric
Druid
Dervish
Godi (Clerics of Thor, Odin, Loki and Hel)
Ethengar Shaman
Atruaghin Shamani
Redhair (Cleric of Halav)
Midwife (Cleric of Vanya)
Mariner (Cleric of Protius)
Holy Defender (Cleric of Petra)
Specialty Priest (for many Immortals)
Fighter
Avenger
Druidic Knight
Griffon Rider
Horse Warrior
Paladin
Magic-User
Hakomon
Wise Woman
Thief
Bard
Bratak
Rake
Mystic
Forester

That's one thing that BECMI has over B/X. I prefer race-as-class, but it works better when you have a larger selection of classes, and B/X wasn't around long enough to develop the idea. However, the OSR has done a great deal of work in correcting that.

UNCLE UNCLE! I give! I yield! I don't mind Multi-classing now! I promise I'll never complain about any other class based game having too many classes! Please make it stop!

 

[Necrozius]

Question: building monsters.

Is there a guide of some sorts on how to properly build creature stats for OSE (or its equivalent)?

Some things are straightforward: HD, saves, XP. But AC, for example: some creatures go beyond full plate and a shield. Is there a system for this?

Yes, I could just wing it or reskin stuff (I usually do), but I’d like to know how to do it. Is there a guide or something somewhere?

(please don’t reply something like: “don’t, just reskin or improvise”, I genuinely want to know if there’s a structure or logic to monster stat creation with this edition)

 

[Brock Savage]

Question: building monsters.

Is there a guide of some sorts on how to properly build creature stats for OSE (or its equivalent)?

Some things are straightforward: HD, saves, XP. But AC, for example: some creatures go beyond full plate and a shield. Is there a system for this?

Yes, I could just wing it or reskin stuff (I usually do), but I’d like to know how to do it. Is there a guide or something somewhere?

(please don’t reply something like: “don’t, just reskin or improvise”, I genuinely want to know if there’s a structure or logic to monster stat creation with this edition)

A lot of people say "don't do it, just reskin" or "just use a bear" because there is no method. There are no CRs or similar things in B/X. You just give it x HD and figure out its AC using armor as a guide. Monsters attack using the Monster "THAC0 by Hit Dice" table and mostly save as Fighter level = HD. There are exceptions like Pixies and Sprites save as Elves and Gnomes save as Dwarfs. Creatures with animal intelligence tend to save at half HD (e.g. a T-Rex has 20 HD but saves at level 10). Intelligent magical creatures like Gargoyles and Unicorns save at twice their HD.

Honestly there is little reason not to reskin a published monster unless you have a really specific gimmick that is incompatible with all the published creatures.

 

[Necrozius]

. There are exceptions like Pixies and Sprites save as Elves and Gnomes save as Dwarfs. Creatures with animal intelligence tend to save at half HD (e.g. a T-Rex has 20 HD but saves at level 10). Intelligent magical creatures like Gargoyles and Unicorns save at twice their HD.

Aha that’s what I’m looking for. Is there a list somewhere with these exceptions? Or is this some esoteric secret OSR cabal knowledge not typical shared with us normies LOL

 

[Rob Necronomicon]

I played BECMI for years as a kid. But to be totally honest I'd really never want to go back to it. Dungeon Crawls, quirky rules, high high fantasy, and samey characters.

Don't get me wrong tho', if peeps are having a good time playing it then that's totally cool. But for me, some of the newer OSR games just leave that older stuff in the dust (IMHO), like BTW, Through Sunken Lands, and Hyperborea.

 

[Bunch]

Could it have been ACKs? If I remember, that has some sort of class customisation built into the core rules. Not sure.

ACKs has more race/class combos and in the Companion it has a full system for building your own race/class combos.

 

[Brock Savage]

Aha that’s what I’m looking for. Is there a list somewhere with these exceptions? Or is this some esoteric secret OSR cabal knowledge not typical shared with us normies LOL

Maybe some kind soul has listed it all out but I did it the rockhead way and read page 138 of OSE, the XP awards on 228 and thumbed through the OSE bestiary.

 

[Dammit Victor]

So I started flipping through Rules and Magic from LotFP and found a c
Are there any specific, external resources that you like to borrow for your B/X game of choice?

All of Timothy Brannan's witch/warlock supplements. Sometimes I just outright replace the core casting classes with them.

I haven't found a martial arts set I really like, outside of trying to convert Flying Swordsmen, which feels like it'd be a bigger pain in the ass than it really would be.

Same thing with psionics. I probably want too much of DSP's 3.X and PF work to really be viable in BECMI.

I would probably lean very hard on ACKS' domain rules if I ever had a serious, long-term D&D game.

 

[kenada]

Question: building monsters.

Is there a guide of some sorts on how to properly build creature stats for OSE (or its equivalent)?

Some things are straightforward: HD, saves, XP. But AC, for example: some creatures go beyond full plate and a shield. Is there a system for this?

Yes, I could just wing it or reskin stuff (I usually do), but I’d like to know how to do it. Is there a guide or something somewhere?

(please don’t reply something like: “don’t, just reskin or improvise”, I genuinely want to know if there’s a structure or logic to monster stat creation with this edition)

Carcass Crawler #3 will have information on creating monsters. Backers of the last Kickstarter already have PDF copies (sans final art). It’s expected to be made available generally after that Kickstarter is shipped.

 

[Necrozius]

Dusting off this thread because I will be running OSE soon at a local game shop.

Carcass Crawler issue 3 helped me fill a few gaps.

Any tips from people on running OSE with new players? Any "modern" design concepts to carry over into it? Example, I'll be using Ascending AC, for sure.

Anything else I should use?

 

[Weru]

I haven't found a martial arts set I really like, outside of trying to convert Flying Swordsmen, which feels like it'd be a bigger pain in the ass than it really would be.

Not sure if you'd like it, Victor, but I attempted a B/X MMA subsystem for my Enkiddu class. It's unfinished, and a bit baroque, though.

 

[Sloth_in_a_bowl]

Dusting off this thread because I will be running OSE soon at a local game shop.

Carcass Crawler issue 3 helped me fill a few gaps.

Any tips from people on running OSE with new players? Any "modern" design concepts to carry over into it? Example, I'll be using Ascending AC, for sure.

Anything else I should use?

If you are not giving your players multiple characters or hirlings and are starting them at low level then you may wish to have some improved survivability.

My usual rules are:
First level PCs receive maximum hit points
First level NPCs receive hit points in the upper range for their class
After first level PCs reroll the hit die once if the first roll is a 1

Characters do not die at 0hp but are seriously injured and may not act.
Characters die at -5 hp (I may increase this at higher levels).
A character on or below 0hp loses 1hp per 3 combat rounds (or every 30 seconds) until cured via magic (no hit points recovered) or has a successful medical skill check applied to them or reaches -5hp in which they are dead.
A failed medical skill check means the character loses 1hp and the skill check can be made again (if the patient is not dead).
If not using a skill system then assume that a wisdom check or less on a d20 works.

Health recovery through resting:
If the character has at least 1 hit point, then they recover 10% of maximum hit points (round up) for every 8 hours of full rest.

If the character has less than 1 hit point then they receive 1 hp for every 24 hours of rest and care, +1 hp for a cure serious wounds spell (once per day). Other magical healing does not speed up healing below 1 hp.

 

[RangerRupert]

Back in the 80s, my friends and I quite unfortunately bought into the idea that B/X was just an intro to AD&D. We all bought one "basic" set or another, but moved on to the PHB/DMG/MM trilogy as soon as possible.

It is unfortunately because, looking at it in retrospect, Moldvay/Cook B/X looks like such a damn elegant game. I really wish that's what we had played, and if I were to join a classic D&D game today, I'd be looking for that.

 

[Weru]

Back in the 80s, my friends and I quite unfortunately bought into the idea that B/X was just an intro to AD&D. We all bought one "basic" set or another, but moved on to the PHB/DMG/MM trilogy as soon as possible.

It is unfortunately because, looking at it in retrospect, Moldvay/Cook B/X looks like such a damn elegant game. I really wish that's what we had played, and if I were to join a classic D&D game today, I'd be looking for that.

We stuck with B/X and delved (pun intended) into the AD&D books for cool stuff like extra classes, monsters, spells, magic items, etc.

 

[RangerRupert]

We stuck with B/X and delved (pun intended) into the AD&D books for cool stuff like extra classes, monsters, spells, magic items, etc.

Now that you mention it, I think we did that too, but in the other direction. We used AD&D classes, monsters, etc., but were basically (ha!) using the B/X combat rules and such.

 

[Fritz]

Dusting off this thread because I will be running OSE soon at a local game shop.

Carcass Crawler issue 3 helped me fill a few gaps.

Any tips from people on running OSE with new players? Any "modern" design concepts to carry over into it? Example, I'll be using Ascending AC, for sure.

Anything else I should use?

Some good ideas here.

Gary Gygax’s Whitebox OD&D House Rules

At the beginning of our World Oranj Whitebox OD&D game I started picking through various common house rulings in order to put together my ...

cyclopeatron.blogspot.com

 

[Fritz]

Now that you mention it, I think we did that too, but in the other direction. We used AD&D classes, monsters, etc., but were basically (ha!) using the B/X combat rules and such.

Yeah, I think many of use were in this boat. We also added rules from Palladium games. Mutations from TMNT and such.