Cyberpunk 2020 and related Interlock games: How do you view Roles?

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Do you see them as basic defining aspects of characters in the game, IOW, everyone has a Role of some kind, special ability and all. Its just that most NPCs are low rated and don't advance like PCs and major NPCs. Joe the Security guard is a Solo, but at +1 or so, Jane in the IT department have Interface at perhaps +1 or maybe +2 if she's the section head or something.

Or do you look at Roles as indicating something is special about that character? Not every thug with a gun is a Solo nor is everyone turns out a computer a Netrunner. They are the ones with the talent, dedication and drive to take their specialty to the edge of ability to pull off feats that are a step above what more mundane people in similar careers can pull off.

I tend to waver back and fourth on the issue.
 
I like interlock overall and the roles are part of that. However, I came to realize they only really make sense for player characters.

It is too time consuming to worry about what role minor non-player characters have and what advantages they provide. Also, if a cop's back-up is coming, or if a fixer knows a fence, or if a corp's got the resources spare, etc. should just be referee decisions.
 
I like interlock overall and the roles are part of that. However, I came to realize they only really make sense for player characters.

It is too time consuming to worry about what role minor non-player characters have and what advantages they provide. Also, if a cop's back-up is coming, or if a fixer knows a fence, or if a corp's got the resources spare, etc. should just be referee decisions.

Generally, I would agree here. The roles and their defining skill are what set the PCs, and some select NPCs apart.
 
As a shorthand, I understand the utility of the roles. In action, I never really liked them.

They weren't really in Mekton II. There were these skill suggestions for certain types of characters, but those groupings weren't roles and were really nothing more than "these are the skills we think a character of this type might have." Players weren't constrained to only pick from those skills or compelled to pick them.

TFOS (basically Interlock d6) was much more freeform. The game had Humans, Near Humans, Not Very Near Humans, and Real Wierdies, but those distinctions weren't anything like Roles and didn't affect skill (Knack) selection in the slightest.

Mekton Z, which came out years after CP2020 didn't use roles in the same way either. Broadly speaking, that game used Veterans and Rookies. Veterans used a lifepath generation method. Rookies were most similar to the CP2020 Roles, but didn't feature Role exclusive skills, and their skill packages amounted to "choose 7 points of skills as a base and during gameplay your IP counts double." I guess in CP2020 terms, they didn't have a rated special ability, but their double XP ability was their Role perk.

Fuzion (which Pondsmith has stated is "no different from Interlock") also lacks Roles in the versions of it I've seen (BGC, C:NM, VOTOMS).

So, I pretty much see CP2020 roles the same as I see those job lists in Mekton II. They're suggestions on what an appropriate skill package for that general character type would be like.
 
I used them for PCs and special NPCs, but yeah, not everyone.

Eventually I moved away from the firm Roles and decided that characters could have whatever class ability and skills that made sense.
 
For the most part, I like the Roles. The problem I have is the Special Abilities. Some, especially Combat Sense (And I LOVE the Solo) would apply to certain other Roles, like TraumaTeam Medtechs or Combat Zone cops... Hell, some Corps would have the Rocker Boy ability, and vice versa...
 
For the most part, I like the Roles. The problem I have is the Special Abilities. Some, especially Combat Sense (And I LOVE the Solo) would apply to certain other Roles, like TraumaTeam Medtechs or Combat Zone cops... Hell, some Corps would have the Rocker Boy ability, and vice versa...

Sometimes roles need some reflooring:
Trauma Team Security or Combat Zone Cops = Solo
Public Relations = Rocker

There is generally a large enough swath of skills to pick the ones you want. The Rocker's Skills are:
Awareness/Notice
Perform
Wardrobe and Style
Composition

Brawling
Play Instrument
Streetwise
Persuasion
Seduction


Six of them fit right in with a corporate PR sleezeball. Then you have your other Skill Points to round the character out.

Then I go to the Cyberpunk Fandom Wiki and see they have an entry right in there along the same lines.

Example: Rockerboy
Variants
Street Poet
Performance Artist
Social Leader/Activist
Politician
 
Sometimes roles need some reflooring:
Trauma Team Security or Combat Zone Cops = Solo
Public Relations = Rocker

There is generally a large enough swath of skills to pick the ones you want. The Rocker's Skills are:
Awareness/Notice
Perform
Wardrobe and Style
Composition

Brawling
Play Instrument
Streetwise
Persuasion
Seduction


Six of them fit right in with a corporate PR sleezeball. Then you have your other Skill Points to round the character out.

Then I go to the Cyberpunk Fandom Wiki and see they have an entry right in there along the same lines.

Example: Rockerboy
Variants
Street Poet
Performance Artist
Social Leader/Activist
Politician
Don't get me wrong, these are GREAT ideas, but a Combat Zone cop, would have Authority AND Combat Sense (Personally, I allow them to get both, but to a max of 10 pts, between them), in my opinion. And I'm talking Combat Medics, not just the security. I understand and I agree, you can change the name of some of the Roles to fit some archetypes. Hell, most basic SWAT/SRT officers are low level Solos too, I believe.

But there's some cross-polination, you know?
 
I also allowed each character to have one secondary role ability that maxed at half round down of their primary role value.
This helped a small team feel more rounded in their abilities.
 
As pointless mechanical gatekeeping, vaguely reminiscent of mechanics I find distasteful, in my case.
 
Don't get me wrong, these are GREAT ideas, but a Combat Zone cop, would have Authority AND Combat Sense (Personally, I allow them to get both, but to a max of 10 pts, between them), in my opinion. And I'm talking Combat Medics, not just the security. I understand and I agree, you can change the name of some of the Roles to fit some archetypes. Hell, most basic SWAT/SRT officers are low level Solos too, I believe.

But there's some cross-polination, you know?

This is something that we see happen in the Lifepaths of 2020, where you can end up with a Family of 2, either through a Nomad Clan or gang. I think there this also an option to learn any Skill at 1 from a teacher. If you felt the concept absolutely required some else's special skill + your own I might want to keep it below 2. If it has to go above that level, maybe ask if this is the correct role and flip it.
 
Don't get me wrong, these are GREAT ideas, but a Combat Zone cop, would have Authority AND Combat Sense (Personally, I allow them to get both, but to a max of 10 pts, between them), in my opinion. And I'm talking Combat Medics, not just the security. I understand and I agree, you can change the name of some of the Roles to fit some archetypes. Hell, most basic SWAT/SRT officers are low level Solos too, I believe.

But there's some cross-polination, you know?
And here's the explanation for my post as well.
 
For the most part, I like the Roles. The problem I have is the Special Abilities. Some, especially Combat Sense (And I LOVE the Solo) would apply to certain other Roles, like TraumaTeam Medtechs or Combat Zone cops... Hell, some Corps would have the Rocker Boy ability, and vice versa...

That's what bothered me about the Special Abilities. Many of them seem like they would be appropriate for various types of character aside from the base role.
 
That's what bothered me about the Special Abilities. Many of them seem like they would be appropriate for various types of character aside from the base role.
Exactly, the Nomad's Family ability would mix well with some top end Solo's who are also made men in Mafia or Yakuza, for example. The aforementioned security guy, whether they be a cop or corporate guard, who has the power of Law behind them, as well as years of combat experience.

Some Special Abilities are unique to each Role, like the MedTech or Netrunner's, then there's some that can simply cross-pollinate. And that ends up being in the house rulings category. Which I'm fine with.
 
As pointless mechanical gatekeeping, vaguely reminiscent of mechanics I find distasteful, in my case.
If you don't my asking, what other mechanics does it remind you of, character classes or something else?
 
Exactly, the Nomad's Family ability would mix well with some top end Solo's who are also made men in Mafia or Yakuza, for example. The aforementioned security guy, whether they be a cop or corporate guard, who has the power of Law behind them, as well as years of combat experience.

Some Special Abilities are unique to each Role, like the MedTech or Netrunner's, then there's some that can simply cross-pollinate. And that ends up being in the house rulings category. Which I'm fine with.
Yeah, that's the thing. Some of the Special Abilities aren't 'skills' per se but what might be called Backgrounds, Perks, or Reputations in other systems so it feels odd when a character's backstory indicates they should have one of those, yet they don't.
 
I love the idea of the 2020 Nomad. But the execution is crappy. Neo Tribes helps fix so e if this, but Family has to be the worst SA in the game.
 
I love the idea of the 2020 Nomad. But the execution is crappy. Neo Tribes helps fix so e if this, but Family has to be the worst SA in the game.

Possibly because it's the most indistinct and reliant on GM interpretation and setup of the role abilities. It's also kind of a proto-meta/storytelling mechanic. How much does Family allow the player to modify the setting on the fly? Even Resources and the Rocker's Charisma skill are more concretely defined.
 
Yeah, that's the thing. Some of the Special Abilities aren't 'skills' per se but what might be called Backgrounds, Perks, or Reputations in other systems so it feels odd when a character's backstory indicates they should have one of those, yet they don't.
Now that I think on it, the Netrunner skill can ALSO be cross classed, as Techs would also have to dip from time to time.
 
Possibly because it's the most indistinct and reliant on GM interpretation and setup of the role abilities. It's also kind of a proto-meta/storytelling mechanic. How much does Family allow the player to modify the setting on the fly? Even Resources and the Rocker's Charisma skill are more concretely defined.
I use the expanded rules for Streetdeal from Wildside for Corporates and Fixers alike. One is contact based, the other is portfolio driven. The and result is the same.
Now that I think on it, the Netrunner skill can ALSO be cross classed, as Techs would also have to dip from time to time.
I always felt that Programming and Library Search are your key netrunner skills that don't add to Initiative when netrunning. Anyone can have them.
 
Now that I think on it, the Netrunner skill can ALSO be cross classed, as Techs would also have to dip from time to time.
And vice versa fairly often though there would be more types of Techies that didn't deep dive into the 'Net though most of them would be pretty familiar with computer hardware and often to at least some degree, software. In a way, Netrunners could almost be 'sub class' of techie, one that focused on electronics software and interface use.
 
And vice versa fairly often though there would be more types of Techies that didn't deep dive into the 'Net though most of them would be pretty familiar with computer hardware and often to at least some degree, software. In a way, Netrunners could almost be 'sub class' of techie, one that focused on electronics software and interface use.
You know, I never thought of that, but yeah. See, my training as a computer tech would put me as a Techie, and I do know a little bit about programming (Which I absorbed osmotic), but I also know quite a few software experts who know their computer hardware and actual electronics.
 
You know, I never thought of that, but yeah. See, my training as a computer tech would put me as a Techie, and I do know a little bit about programming (Which I absorbed osmotic), but I also know quite a few software experts who know their computer hardware and actual electronics.
Techies can bodge anything to work for a bit. I'd say they are more mechanic than computer guy.

I liked liked Interlock Unlimited patch of.making every SA add to a pair of skills in much the same way Combat Sense does.
 
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