DUNE

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Silent Green said:
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Chtorr! Chtorr!
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Hm. The Muppets go to Arrakis.
 
Luca said:
It's ok. I mean you're the one who also likes Evangelion, aren't you?
Out of hundreds of anime I've seen, Evangelion is the only one which I rate 0/10. Usually there's something... at least one slightly redeeming feature which gives the work one point.
Not so with NGE.

We should plan an evening at the movie together sometime :tongue:
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I'll just leave this here - Sandworm waifu?

792
 
Manga is way worse - far more fanservice than any series
 
Speaking of which, has anyone read the Dune comic adaptation? Any good?

I have no interest in these non-Frank Herbert spin-offs but as this is an adaptation of the original novel I would think the work of the artists is more important than the adapters (hopefully).

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TristramEvans said:
Manga is way worse - far more fanservice than any series
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Probably true, most of the manga I've read has not been turned into anime so I have a narrow range for comparison. But my limited experience so far, for instance with the Parasyte anime adaptation of the manga, I see a lot of dumb characterization tropes and fanservice inserted into the anime that wasn't in the manga.

Mangas in general may have more fanservice (they certainly usually can have greater levels of sex and violence) but when a good manga is adapted into an anime it seems they feel the need to add these elements not in the original.
 
I dunno, nothing's universal. The infamous Goblin Slayer anime is way less explicit than the manga, f'rex. But there's also plenty of pretty straight fantasy adaptions that aren't aimed at an adolescent male Japanese audience specifically - Berserk, Le Guin Saga, Howl's Moving Castle, etc.
 
Quite true, the shitty additions to Parasyte have just made me gunshy of anime adaptations of manga I like lately.

As usual the real question would be who was doing the adaptation and how reasonably free of corporate influence they would be.

I tend to prefer anime features so I would hope for that over a TV series personally. A series would have much more room to tell the story but I'd be worried about the quality control and budget being sufficient.
 
Voros said:
Quite true, the shitty additions to Parasyte have just made me gunshy of anime adaptations of manga I like lately.

As usual the real question would be who was doing the adaptation and how reasonably free of corporate influence they would be.

I tend to prefer anime features so I would hope for that over a TV series personally. A series would have much more room to tell the story but I'd be worried about the quality control and budget being sufficient.
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I guess dream scenario would be a joint US studio-Japanese production
 
Nobby-W said:
I'm sure there are folks who would pay good money for that up on K road.
Now Mistress Gaius Moham says you've been a very naughty boy.
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...everyone knows I'm talking about the poisoned blade and not the pain box, right?
 
Voros said:
I'd probably rather see a manga adaptation so it wouldn't have any painful anime tropes shoehorned into it.

Naussica felt like it was likely influenced by Dune.

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ah - Miyazaki-san. Corporate says we need more waifus. They want you to work a tsundere into the script - and can you do a step-sister arc for Paul?
 
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Back on the femworm, I do wonder if that was where book 7 was heading with Sheena. It almost felt like it was foreshadowed at the end of Chapterhouse. They're headed off into space in a no ship with a cargo hold full of sand trout and the girl who can talk to worms and the BG have been building her up as a religious figure and there's been all this talk through the book asking why Leto II did it.
 
I'd also agree that Anime can be done well; not all of it becomes over-the-top Dragonball Z explodey-fests.

Studio Ghibli doing Dune or Lord of the Rings, for example?
 
Necrozius said:
I'd also agree that Anime can be done well; not all of it becomes over-the-top Dragonball Z explodey-fests.

Studio Ghibli doing Dune or Lord of the Rings, for example?
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I think doing it as a TV series could work with one of those. I think Miyazaki will eventually make good on his threat to retire, so maybe not Ghibli but I think the format could be made to work. In theory a Western production company could also do it, but they're still mired in children's entertainment so a Japanese studio is more likely to be able to take something like that on and make it work.
 
Saw the movie last night. I really enjoyed it. I have a mountain of nitpicks. I was ok with many of the changes though. It definitely looks amazing. Here's my mind dump of thoughts on the movie:

I really wish the Baron monologued more. I loved his bond villain monologues in the book. I respect the choice to not do inner monologues, makes for a much better movie.
I didn't like the duel with Jamis. Paul was only supposed to try to get him to yield once, then it's the fact that he is attacking slowly because he is trained for shield fighting that makes it harder. Not that he's not used to killing.
I did love what they did with the vision to set Jamis up as a possible friend and father figure. The monkey's paw of Vision Jamis promising to teach him the ways of the desert was a great way to show how prophecy works.
In general the fight choreography was really good. You could see everyone being fast on defense, slow on attack. You saw people relying on the shield to protect them.
Speaking of the Baron Monologuing. WHERE IS MY ARTILLERY FIRE?!?!
One major nitpick. We see shields everywhere during the invasion of Arrakis, but they use a lasgun. Do you want a nuclear explosion? Because this is how you get a nuclear explosion!
I AM HERE FOR ATREIDES BAGPIPES.
I like how they gave Dr. Yuei his own superpower with his ability to check vitals by touch. I wish they had brought up the Imperial Conditioning and his struggle with his betrayal. Instead, he just comes out of nowhere with his betrayal and there's little weight behind it. The source of the Atreides strength is the loyalty they inspire, so creating a traitor is Harkonnen philosophy conquering the Atreides philosophy.
Not sure how I feel about them removing the plans within plans of Leto and Hawat to make everyone think Jessica is suspected as a traitor.
I hope we see what happened to Hawat during the battle. The part where the Fremen take the news they killed Saudakar as a bit of fun news is my favorite.
They did a great job restructuring a lot of the exposition, like getting across the kind of man the Old Duke with context clues.
The Portrait was amazing.
Love the way they did battle languages and hand signs. No explanations, just subtitles and LETS GO!!!
At first I thought Jessica was expressing too much emotion, but why would a Bene Gesseritt utter the Litany Against Fear unless they were truly afraid.
I was really worried about the Gom Jabar scene and how they would pull it off. I loved how they did it though.
SHAI HALUD DEMANDS YOUR RESPECT. USUL SUMMONED A GREAT MAKER. Love how they saved the full reveal and it was amazing.
The Baron rearing up like a cobra every time he did evil shit was great.
I wish we got more of Pieter being Pieter and the Baron using him. I'm worried they will write out Hawat entirely or it won't really work in the next movie.
Really annoyed that Paul isn't a Mentat. That was one of the big parts of his "Chosen One"-ness was that he was super cool and like the best and had the powers of all 3 guilds, Mentats, Bene Gesserit, and The Spacers Guild.
Really annoyed that the fact that Navigators need Spice is a known fact in the movie. That secret is a major plot point to help defang the guild at the end
 
Extensive breakdown of the iconic Gom Jabbar scene with Denis.

 
Caught Dune tonight.

I liked it quite a bit.

It borrows heavily from Lynch's film in terms of the costume and set-design, which is a good thing I think as the look is the best thing in Lynch's film. This film is shot dark, maybe too dark at times but generally avoids being too drab and grey, with some very striking sequences of the spaceships in particular.

I love the look of the Space Navigators (very much Space Popes) although we don't get any fishcreatures yet (fingers crossed!).

A surprising amount is left unexplained here for those not familiar with the world from the book and Lynch's film (mentats for instance are here but never explained) but I like that personally.

This film drops the infodumps and overdubbed character-thoughts that I think were studio-enforced in Lynch's film anyway.

Here the actors are trusted to communicate more wordlessly. Chalamet is effective as a young Paul and Ferguson brings impressive charisma and gravitas as Jessica.

Isaac is good in his few scenes with Paul in particular back on Caladan. Oh and Caladan itself is beautiful, some really lovely sequences there.

But as I suspected no one is going to top Ken McMillan as Baron Harkonen or Dourif as De Vries. The Harkonens are a bit sketchy here in general, you don't even see The Emperor but I would expect that to be filled out in the next film.

Duncan Idaho, an underwhelming character who dies quickly for no apparent reason in the original film, is more heroic and engaging here. The Sardaukar are also much more frightening and intimidating.



Not surprisingly, Villeneuve is also a better director of action scenes although he doesn't drag them out either. I thought the betrayal and defeat of the Atreidies was well done although Dr. Yueh doesn't manage the pathos of Dean Stockwell's melodramatic performance.

The battle scenes are more faithful to the book I think and more dynamic and exciting than Lynch, but I always thought that was clearly the part of the film that least interested Lynch whereas Villenneuve proved his action chops with Sicario.

Another thing I think this version does better than the 'original' film is communicate the importance of the visions of Paul, their relationship to the spice and his terror at the coming jihad.

The Hans Zimmer score works well, it is prominent but integrated into the films look and feel, similar to Blade Runner 2049 and Sicario in that regard.

Here's a good short featurette on the score.



It all very much ends on a character beat and near media res, which is pretty gutsy for an expensive blockbuster style film. Part two seems likely to happen as the film seems to have been a big hit.
 
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I didn't like the "Shield Buster" bombs. I know it's not as exciting, but I liked the Baron using Artillery to drop buildings and collapse caves on the Atreides. Really drove home the cruelty. I also didn't like the lazgun being used to try and shoot down the Shielded Ornithopter. Although the Lazgun effect was really awesome. I'm hopeful that Part 2 will give us more Mentat. I thought it was odd that they have seemingly written out that Paul is actually a mentat in training.
 
I think it is very possible we will get more stuff on the fall of house Atreidesfrom the perspective of Gurney Halleck in the second part, that may include the plot to implicate Jessica as the traitor. Also perhaps more on Mentats and Paul being one. In general, whenever a book is turned into a film, even when it is only half the book like here, stuff will be need to be cut. The subplot with Jessica being suspected may be something that needed to be cut, or something that was saved for the sequel. I'm happy that they didn't feel the need to add anything. And the score is very very good, yeah.
 
I think it was an error not to just film the movies back to back like Peter Jackson did with the Lord of the Rings movies. It would have been cheaper for the studio to just continue the shoot in the long run I think.

My wife and I enjoyed the movie overall though I tend to have concerns since they're just going to do this in two movies. The first book is thick enough with information, depth and varied things going on that I tend to think that it would have been better to do the book as a trilogy.
 
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