Game like Five Torches Deep, but with more crunch?

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arjunstc

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I ran Barrowmaze using Five Torches Deep and had a lot of fun, but I found the small spell lists limiting: the spell-user PCs ended up choosing the same few spells.

Are there rules out there that are just a little crunchier than 5TD, with a few more character class options and spells, but not to the extent of 5E or the other more "complete" OSR rule sets?

Thanks.
 
The easiest answer might just be to expand the 5TD spell lists. They're all based on classic spells and the format is simple, so adding another 5 options per level (say) should be pretty trivial. You could loop the players in on that and get them to 5TD some of their favorites too.
 
I was going to suggest expanding the 5TD spell list but Fenris-77 Fenris-77 beat me to it.

Into the Unknown uses the 5e SRD as a base with no skills, no sub classes, no feats, simpler and fewer backgrounds, a condensed weapon list, and only 10 levels. It's crunchier than 5TD but might hit the sweet spot you are looking for.
 
I feel like the game you want to play is B/X, OSE, Legend Lord, 1EAD&D, or some similarly 'clean' version of pre-3E D&D. If you set aside your preconceptions and just play B/X D&D as it was written (obviously, plus whatever house rules turn your crank), it is delightfully light and transparent while supplying all the 'content' of spells, monsters, items, dungeons, etc. you could ask for.

(Except for spells of summoning - for some reason B/X and its relatives missed the boat on that count!).
 
(Except for spells of summoning - for some reason B/X and its relatives missed the boat on that count!).
Ahem, LotFP has a "summoning" spell which was lauded as a work of genius (read: lots of fun, especially for the Referee...:devil:), and is part of the free ruleset they've got on Drivethru. If you're happy with the rest of the OSR rules, don't let the lack of a summoning spell stop you:thumbsup:!
 
Torchbearer?
...only if you think the GM should get a separate "turn", and are fine fitting what happens to the rules instead of the other way around, IME:thumbsup:.

Full disclosure, I'm a backer of Torchbearer which doesn't have even a decent abbreviation (it coincides with a well-known disease), because I was interested in finding out what the story guys can make a dungeoncrawl actually fun...:tongue:
I tried playing it exactly once:shade:.
Long story short, "the fiction" started diverging from "the rules" in Turn One. We never made it to Turn Two, as the rules kept reminding us to follow them and it all would be fine.
Nobody was persuaded, including the GM that had pitched it. That was a record short live for a campaign that actually started.
 
Torchbearer is an awesome game, but it's crunchier and less forgiving than some people are looking for. The play loops in TB are elegant and super tight, but does take some time to figure out how the game runs, usually more than a single session. I think the book mentions that it might take 4 or 5 sessions to really start getting a feel for how the moving parts fit together.
 
Thanks for all the answers.

I think the answer is indeed adding spells from 5E to the existing lists. Most of the spells in 5TD are actually just renamed 5E spells of the same level or one below, with reduced effect or range anyway.
 
Ahem, LotFP has a "summoning" spell which was lauded as a work of genius (read: lots of fun, especially for the Referee...:devil:), and is part of the free ruleset they've got on Drivethru. If you're happy with the rest of the OSR rules, don't let the lack of a summoning spell stop you:thumbsup:!
Thanks for the tip. Though I'm not hot on collecting gobs of basically similar game systems as a way of stitching together the game I want to play. I'd rather people distributed smaller collections of house rules for common games, as opposed to having 500 different versions of old-school D&D in print, each devoting 90% of their page count to reproducing stuff that's been part of the core game since the 70's
 
Thanks for the tip. Though I'm not hot on collecting gobs of basically similar game systems as a way of stitching together the game I want to play. I'd rather people distributed smaller collections of house rules for common games, as opposed to having 500 different versions of old-school D&D in print, each devoting 90% of their page count to reproducing stuff that's been part of the core game since the 70's
You'd like it, but would they sell stuff? I suspect not. There are also lots of good OSR properties that aren't 90% repo anyway.
 
Thanks for the tip. Though I'm not hot on collecting gobs of basically similar game systems as a way of stitching together the game I want to play. I'd rather people distributed smaller collections of house rules for common games, as opposed to having 500 different versions of old-school D&D in print, each devoting 90% of their page count to reproducing stuff that's been part of the core game since the 70's
Akin to Fenris-77 Fenris-77 I have to ask, "but who would buy them"? According to some OSR sources whom I used to follow on blogs, the item that sells the most is always the corebook:grin:!
Blame the market:thumbsup:.
 
Thanks for the tip. Though I'm not hot on collecting gobs of basically similar game systems as a way of stitching together the game I want to play. I'd rather people distributed smaller collections of house rules for common games, as opposed to having 500 different versions of old-school D&D in print, each devoting 90% of their page count to reproducing stuff that's been part of the core game since the 70's
There are several expansions for 5td, and this one I know has new spells - https://www.drivethrurpg.com/product/378564/Five-Torches-Deep-Highfane-Peaks
 
It does, but most of them are rather bespoke for that setting (Ordomancy and Stonesoul). I'm sure you could tweak them a bit, but it might just be easier to convert "standard" D&D spells.
Or they might be adapted to a new setting, if they fit the vision of the Referee for the setting? I mean, I'm not sure what Stonesoul does exactly, but it does sound roughly like something that I'd adopt in lots of settings...:grin:
 
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