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Dan Davenport

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Hello, all! I just stumbled across this forum by way of the Wicked Pacts thread and thought I should introduce myself.

I've been gaming since around 1981. I run a blog called The Hardboiled GMshoe's Office and the unofficial #rpgnet chatroom. (Stop by! Good friends, no flames!)

So how would you guys describe the vibe here? So far, it seems pretty chill. :smile:
 

Endless Flight

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Welcome to the Pub, Dan.

Shipyard pretty much nailed it. We are going to be a laid back and friendly place where you can chat about games and other things you enjoy. I'd like it if everyone felt welcome here. I think some places scare people away with unwritten (and written) rules about who they want to be a member there and how they want said members to post.
 

Dan Davenport

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By the way: What are the rules regarding promotions? I ask because I regularly host Q&As in my chatroom and post the announcements of them in various forums.
 

thedungeondelver

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It is very chill here and outside of KnKA where I go to soak in the pure mineral hot-springs of 1e AD&D goodness and my own (defunct) forum I can see this becoming my favorite place to talk about RPGs, certainly my favorite to talk about RPGs in general rather than the specificity of 1e and Original D&D at KnKA.
 

Dan Davenport

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It is very chill here and outside of KnKA where I go to soak in the pure mineral hot-springs of 1e AD&D goodness and my own (defunct) forum I can see this becoming my favorite place to talk about RPGs, certainly my favorite to talk about RPGs in general rather than the specificity of 1e and Original D&D at KnKA.
I'm sure I should know this, but... KnKA? :smile:
 

thedungeondelver

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Is Dragonsfoot no good?

I really prefer 1e AD&D discussion to be 1e AD&D discussion and not have "helpful suggestions" about "just doing it like in 2e", then taking flack from moderators when pointing out that the sub-forum the post was in is the 1e forum, and the inverse happening likewise.

But that's cross-forum drama.

Suffice to say, I prefer KnKA because again, it's pure 1e and OD&D.
 

Leon ap Hywel

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I really prefer 1e AD&D discussion to be 1e AD&D discussion and not have "helpful suggestions" about "just doing it like in 2e", then taking flack from moderators when pointing out that the sub-forum the post was in is the 1e forum, and the inverse happening likewise.

But that's cross-forum drama.

Suffice to say, I prefer KnKA because again, it's pure 1e and OD&D.
Do they include BECMI in the fold? Sounds daft but I've had a few people get itchy discussing it!

Genuine question as your a 1e fan but what do you prefer about it to 2e? I kinda jumped 1e but I'd be blind not to notice it has its adherents.
 

Dan Davenport

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Do they include BECMI in the fold? Sounds daft but I've had a few people get itchy discussing it!

Genuine question as your a 1e fan but what do you prefer about it to 2e? I kinda jumped 1e but I'd be blind not to notice it has its adherents.

Now, see there? That's so much nicer than "Your favorite game sucks!!" :grin:
 

thedungeondelver

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Do they include BECMI in the fold? Sounds daft but I've had a few people get itchy discussing it!

Genuine question as your a 1e fan but what do you prefer about it to 2e? I kinda jumped 1e but I'd be blind not to notice it has its adherents.

Fairly asked, and I will try to answer.

Generally, it is the tone of the game. AD&D 1e is largely informed by grittier sword and sorcery. Gary's "High Gygaxian" tone when writing, and the convivial attitude towards the DM and players along with its wry sense of humor.

2e on the other hand strips out a lot of the "Inspired by EC and Conan comics" vibe that 1e has. It's tone is more blase', it is passive, and what it was most informed by wasn't an amalgam of different literary sources, but TSR's own romantic fantasy novels. A lot of "sharp edges" were filed off. Case in point, the half-orc and the assassin class. These things were removed by design. When I read a 2e rulebook or module, or, indeed even late 1e rulebooks and modules that weren't written by Gary, I feel like I'm reading fantasy stereo instructions.

I get a lot of this:
1uy4dn.jpg

...when I make my case, but I dunno what to tell people who take that tack. There's minor rules differences, and a world of difference between the editions. I don't think that makes 2e objectively bad, it's just not something I want. I don't eat kale, or steak tartar, or drink McEwen's Brown Ale. Some folks do, and there's folks that don't like what I do like.
 

Leon ap Hywel

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Fairly asked, and I will try to answer.

Generally, it is the tone of the game. AD&D 1e is largely informed by grittier sword and sorcery. Gary's "High Gygaxian" tone when writing, and the convivial attitude towards the DM and players along with its wry sense of humor.

2e on the other hand strips out a lot of the "Inspired by EC and Conan comics" vibe that 1e has. It's tone is more blase', it is passive, and what it was most informed by wasn't an amalgam of different literary sources, but TSR's own romantic fantasy novels. A lot of "sharp edges" were filed off. Case in point, the half-orc and the assassin class. These things were removed by design. When I read a 2e rulebook or module, or, indeed even late 1e rulebooks and modules that weren't written by Gary, I feel like I'm reading fantasy stereo instructions.

I get a lot of this:
View attachment 123

...when I make my case, but I dunno what to tell people who take that tack. There's minor rules differences, and a world of difference between the editions. I don't think that makes 2e objectively bad, it's just not something I want. I don't eat kale, or steak tartar, or drink McEwen's Brown Ale. Some folks do, and there's folks that don't like what I do like.
It's what you feel so you can't be wrong. Bit silly to tell you otherwise. Doesn't mean they have to agree but opinions are just that.

I'll have to do a 1e read through to see if I get the same vibe.
 

Bunch

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It's what you feel so you can't be wrong. Bit silly to tell you otherwise. Doesn't mean they have to agree but opinions are just that.

I'll have to do a 1e read through to see if I get the same vibe.
I'm not sure it will catch some of the reasons people who started with 1st edition prefer it.

Sometimes it's just about where and when it hit you in life. I was a young kid when 1st edition came out with little understanding of how corporations worked. First edition is written by a guy. Sure there's others involved but it's pretty much Gary writing and no one saying this should be there or oh you shouldn't say that.
Second edition came out when I was in high school. I learned by then how corporations work, how they manipulate things for sales, how they avoid risk. When you compare the two you'll see where the hobby which was a big business became a corporation running a business in the hobby industry. It's more polished. It's been thought out more, streamlined a bit, certainly explained better but kind of bland.

Unearthed arcana sort of sums 1st edition up. They thought why make everyone repurchase the rules just to get these updated bits.

Second edition has splat books. Targeted, play tested, verbose and a plethora of them.

I do think as time went on 2nd edition got it's own soul and lost some of the corporate blandness.
 

Leon ap Hywel

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I'm not sure it will catch some of the reasons people who started with 1st edition prefer it.

Sometimes it's just about where and when it hit you in life. I was a young kid when 1st edition came out with little understanding of how corporations worked. First edition is written by a guy. Sure there's others involved but it's pretty much Gary writing and no one saying this should be there or oh you shouldn't say that.
Second edition came out when I was in high school. I learned by then how corporations work, how they manipulate things for sales, how they avoid risk. When you compare the two you'll see where the hobby which was a big business became a corporation running a business in the hobby industry. It's more polished. It's been thought out more, streamlined a bit, certainly explained better but kind of bland.

Unearthed arcana sort of sums 1st edition up. They thought why make everyone repurchase the rules just to get these updated bits.

Second edition has splat books. Targeted, play tested, verbose and a plethora of them.

I do think as time went on 2nd edition got it's own soul and lost some of the corporate blandness.
2e was 'my game' so I actually loved the material. It's great going back though and seeing the sometimes just subtle variations.
 
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