Modiphius is doing Dune

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My only exposure to the 2d20 system was the CONAN quick-start they gave out on Free RPG Day. I don't know just how representative of the complete game it was, but... ugh.

Sad to see both Barsoom and Dune tied to that ugly-ass wagon.
 
It’s easy to resist after buying Conan and having no urge to run it. Even the bloated d20 version of Conan got me more excited.

I think the best 2d20 game is Coriolis.
 
2d20 seems excessive What's the basic mechanic there?
 
Endless Flight said:
It’s easy to resist after buying Conan and having no urge to run it. Even the bloated d20 version of Conan got me more excited.

I think the best 2d20 game is Coriolis.
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Coriolis is d6 pool (Year Zero engine) by Free League. Modiphius just distributes.
 
tenbones said:
this IS the Gom Jabbar, isn't it?
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latest
 
The 2d20 system seems fine to me but they use it for everything which it really doesn't fit. This may be of interest anyway for the setting material though.
 
I haven't played the 2d20 system, so this isn't a particularly informed opinion, but reading the John Carter and Conan quickstarts, it seems like they weren't sure if they wanted a traditional system, or a narrative one, or a combo of both, but that they really wanted to use their own system instead of just licensing something else. The problem is, the mechanics don't really appear do anything that other systems don't already do, and I'd say at a glance, it's not clear that they do any of it any better either. I think they probably would have done well to pick a system such as Savage Worlds, Fate, or Cortex Prime, and just gone with those mechanics, while focusing more on the settings, which are really the selling points anyway.
 
Voros said:
The 2d20 system seems fine to me but they use it for everything which it really doesn't fit. This may be of interest anyway for the setting material though.
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I'm of the complete opposite view. There's no reason why a company couldn't use a single house system as the chassis for several properties like Dune, Conan, Star Trek, etc...

It's the 2d20 and its implementations that suck ass.
 
I suppose the question for me is why would 2d20 be a poor fit? I'm assuming you all have opinions as to what would be better/more appropriate.

I know for me anything class/level is right out. But at the same time, at least for me, the interesting parts of Dune were all at the higher levels of society/intrigue, so a character's abilities as an individual weren't necessarily as impressive/important as their position within their organization. So, a Life Path that was more your "career path" (or something) seems like it'd be good.

No idea how to deal with all the Machiavellian bits, particularly if you're Bene...
 
It is interesting that they figured out their nitch is to work quickly through the various company IP approvals setups. They built a decent track record and now they are capitalizing on it. It's very smart whatever you think of the system. Im curious does anyone know if they pulled people from Mongoose who happened to work on getting the books through IP review?
 
Bunch said:
Im curious does anyone know if they pulled people from Mongoose who happened to work on getting the books through IP review?
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Mongoose jumped to mind for me as well, what with them being the previous champions at grabbing up lots of highly visible IP and choking some cash out of it.

If I wanted a Dune game I'd probably just use Fading Suns.
 
Clever timing, with the Dune movies looking set for about 2020.

For me, Dune is the one setting that makes talks of the system used seem inconsequential to me. It remains, for me, the best work of science fiction bar none.

That said, the 2D20 isn't my favourite system - but it's likely to be used as a house system if they've already done Star Trek and Conan.
 
Is the Dune movie being done by Paramount?
 
TristramEvans said:
2d20 seems excessive What's the basic mechanic there?
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My sole experience was one demo game and an after-game read-through of the quick-start pamphlet so keep that in mind.

You have an ability score (IIRC, roughly 3-18). You have a skill (IIRC roughly 1-5). You roll 2d20 but do not add them. If a d20 rolls under your ability score, you get one "Success". If it rolls under both your ability score and your skill, you get two "Successes". Thus, by rolling the standard 2d20 you could get up to four successes if you were really lucky (In the demo I played in no situation arose in which we could roll more than 2d20. I don't know what the rules are in the finished game.). Some actions require 5 or more successes... you can only pull them off by giving the GM points of Doom in exchange for extra successes. Doom points can be used by the GM to screw PCs over or fuel the special abilities of Big Bad NPCs. Things get more complicated- MUCH more complicated- if you attempt special maneuvers in combats, likes disarms or similar.

It's all very... 90s. The system slowed to a crawl whenever anybody tried anything more complicated than "I hit it with my axe". I hope it was just a case of a bad GM but reading through the quick-start afterwards didn't make anything clearer.
 
I think Dune has too many idiosynchrasies to be done with Traveller straight.

Traveller characters are basically ordinary folk with professional training and maybe a few technological enhancements. Dune characters enter into superhuman characteristics by virtue of rejecting technology in order to maximise human potential. Secondly, whereas Traveller is straight space opera - moving around space in fairly autonomous spacecraft - Space travel in Dune is almost a spiritual event of folding space-time with spice, and is controlled by Guilds. Moreover, most of the action occurs planet-side and is driven by political exchanges.

Dune has got archetypal 'classes' of sort, in the form of specialised trainings, and House to belong to as well. If they can incorporate some sort of mechanism to accentuate the politics between Houses, then they should be right.
 
Trippy said:
I think Dune has too many idiosynchrasies to be done with Traveller straight.

Traveller characters are basically ordinary folk with professional training and maybe a few technological enhancements. Dune characters enter into superhuman characteristics by virtue of rejecting technology in order to maximise human potential. Secondly, whereas Traveller is straight space opera - moving around space in fairly autonomous spacecraft - Space travel in Dune is almost a spiritual event of folding space-time with spice, and is controlled by Guilds. Moreover, most of the action occurs planet-side and is driven by political exchanges.

Dune has got archetypal 'classes' of sort, in the form of specialised trainings, and House to belong to as well. If they can incorporate some sort of mechanism to accentuate the politics between Houses, then they should be right.
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Yeah I don't think most Dune-based games would be focused on combat per se so it may work depending how much thought they put into it.
 
Yep, I've been reading through the social combat rules in the recent V5 rules, and this sort of thing could go a long way in Dune too.
 
I'd never play it but I might consider buying it if it would make a good sourcebook for a ruleset I like better. I'd have to see what was in it and how good/bad the writing and art is.
dune-where-are-my-feelings.gif​
(In my mind I always see the David Lynch movie when I think of Dune).
 
Dumarest said:
I'd never play it but I might consider buying it if it would make a good sourcebook for ruleset I like better. I'd have to see what was in it and how good/bad the writing and art is.

(In my mind I always see the David Lynch movie when I think of Dune).
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Now I love David Lynch movies, but aside from some stylish visuals, it really is a terrible adaptation of the source material. It introduces things that just aren't in the book at all - the sound-based weapons, for example, or the 'telepathic' Bene Gessert - spins out into it's own weird themes, couldn't adequetely find a way of developing exposition without excessive use of inner monologue, has characters acting in more melodramatic ways rather than the expedient ways they act in the books, and wasn't a finished, coherant story largely because they couldn't squeeze the material into a two hour film. Lynch himself has disowned the movie as he lost control of the final cut, while he wasn't really that keen on science fiction anyway.

In short, it was a studio film that went wrong and while it remains interesting, it is still something that could be hugely improved upon.
 
The Lynch Dune is a glorious disaster. But, despite having seen it first, and thinking it's full of some iconic brutalism designs, when I read the books, it's not what I picture. I actually think Mad Max Fury Road came closer in visuals to what Herbert's writing evokes for me.
 
The Weiding Way martial arts, wasn't based on sound, but on precognition. It could actually be done in a similar cinematic way they did with those recent Sherlock Holmes movies and TV show.
 
Trippy said:
Now I love David Lynch movies, but aside from some stylish visuals, it really is a terrible adaptation of the source material. It introduces things that just aren't in the book at all - the sound-based weapons, for example, or the 'telepathic' Bene Gessert - spins out into it's own weird themes, couldn't adequetely find a way of developing exposition without excessive use of inner monologue, has characters acting in more melodramatic ways rather than the expedient ways they act in the books, and wasn't a finished, coherant story largely because they couldn't squeeze the material into a two hour film. Lynch himself has disowned the movie as he lost control of the final cut, while he wasn't really that keen on science fiction anyway.

In short, it was a studio film that went wrong and while it remains interesting, it is still something that could be hugely improved upon.
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All true but I love how bug crazy it is and all the overheated melodramatic dialgoue is taken almost verbatim from the novel!
 
I read the first book of the series and didn't think much of it. I wasn't even interested in seeing the Lynch movie till some friends dragged me out to see it and... I loved it! The movie worked much better for me than the book, probably because of the added weirdness and color. I would have loved to have seen the Jodorowsky version... sigh.

Still, it's not a setting that feels ripe for an RPG... or rather it's a cool setting that, as written, I see better served by a board game. Maybe because, in RPGs, I prefer playing the little guys at street level... not the big movers-n-shakers.
 
Simlasa said:
I read the first book of the series and didn't think much of it. I wasn't even interested in seeing the Lynch movie till some friends dragged me out to see it and... I loved it! The movie worked much better for me than the book, probably because of the added weirdness and color. I would have loved to have seen the Jodorowsky version... sigh.

Still, it's not a setting that feels ripe for an RPG... or rather it's a cool setting that, as written, I see better served by a board game. Maybe because, in RPGs, I prefer playing the little guys at street level... not the big movers-n-shakers.
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I'd hold your views until you start seeing the new movie trailers at least. Like I say, the timing of the RPG release could be perfect for the hype that is yet to come.
 
Simlasa said:
Still, it's not a setting that feels ripe for an RPG... or rather it's a cool setting that, as written, I see better served by a board game. Maybe because, in RPGs, I prefer playing the little guys at street level... not the big movers-n-shakers.
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Yeah. Much as I loved the book, I'm tempted to agree.
What I would actually prefer in this kind of case, is a game that was a bit of a knock off of the setting - desert planet - monopoly on a precious commodity - prophecies and religion and all those sort of trappings - but with the story more open and adaptations to make it a bit more suitable for gaming.

When it comes to gaming I much prefer settings inspired by particular media rather than faithful adaptations. In the latter case I always feel constrained to play around the edges of the story.
 
TJS said:
Yeah. Much as I loved the book, I'm tempted to agree.
What I would actually prefer in this kind of case, is a game that was a bit of a knock off of the setting - desert planet - monopoly on a precious commodity - prophecies and religion and all those sort of trappings - but with the story more open and adaptations to make it a bit more suitable for gaming.

When it comes to gaming I much prefer settings inspired by particular media rather than faithful adaptations. In the latter case I always feel constrained to play around the edges of the story.
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Then just play generic sci-fi and screw the details?

If I buy any adaptation, or licensed setting, then authenticity remains absolutely key to me. Moreover, the challenge of game design is to make any given setting viable as a gaming tool and premise. Some games are more successful than others in that respect, but if an authentic design wasn't the key in certain adaptations, then we wouldn't have seen the actual game design developments found in Ghostbusters or Pendragon, for example. We'd all just be playing D&D, old school. Admittedly, that is all that some gamers play….
 
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TJS said:
Yeah. Much as I loved the book, I'm tempted to agree.
What I would actually prefer in this kind of case, is a game that was a bit of a knock off of the setting - desert planet - monopoly on a precious commodity - prophecies and religion and all those sort of trappings - but with the story more open and adaptations to make it a bit more suitable for gaming.

When it comes to gaming I much prefer settings inspired by particular media rather than faithful adaptations. In the latter case I always feel constrained to play around the edges of the story.
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I agree, and think I've said almost the same thing here on the Pub a while back. It's also why I keep thinking Fading Suns whenever I consider gaming "Dune".

But a clever game could find an approach that works. And at the very least a nice sourcebook with pretty art would be nifty.
 
I think there is a tendency to make every setting fit the small group of freebooters premise that D&D and to a certain degree Traveller established. I get that but it can also be reductive and inappropriate for certain settings, if you have to twist the setting so much to rationalize that play why even bother using the setting. It is just another side of applying the same base game mechanic to every setting and genre.
 
Voros said:
I think there is a tendency to make every setting fit the small group of freebooters premise that D&D and to a certain degree Traveller established. I get that but it can also be reductive and inappropriate for certain settings, if you have to twist the setting so much to rationalize that play why even bother using the setting.
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I don't think that Dune actually needs that much twisting to make it a viable gaming experience myself. No more than The One Ring, for example, or even titles like Pendragon or Vampire. Indeed, we were unfortunate to see the last version of the Dune game pulled so early before it got any truction in the type of gameplay it was trying to achieve. According to one of the developers, there was an unpublished campaign that was "perfect" - which we never got to see.
 
I know the game wouldn't be this ambitious, but a high level political game between Houses of the Landstraad would be an awesome way to approach Dune. Like the Old School D&D endgame as the starting position.
 
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