I loved Shadow World and Kulthea as it was. StormRiders was pretty good too- I loved the conceit of the basic concepts with Brion and Kella being from a different world.
Yeah, I enjoyed those novels as well.
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I loved Shadow World and Kulthea as it was. StormRiders was pretty good too- I loved the conceit of the basic concepts with Brion and Kella being from a different world.
Yeah, but they advertised the rpg. I ran a couple month long Run Out the Guns campaign in 2019. I really think something similar in a fantasy game could have worked really well for Rolemaster as a jumping on point. I will note however that for a game that revolves around trade and piracy, Run Out the Guns lacks a trade good price list for bales of cotton etc.Bladelands was the miniatures battle game based on a continent of Shadow World. John Curtis (of the original ICE) wanted to kill Shadow World to create his Bladelands setting (literally!!!!!). His idea was that Kulthea blew up and thus you have this one continent sailing through space (kinda like Argo City from Krypton) in a magical bubble....
In fact, the intro for the last Shadow World product put out by the original ICE, the forward begins with "in this fatal product" (Curse of Kabis, I think it was).
Run Out the Guns
containing a large roster of pregens to avoid the PITA of post E-crit RM chargen
An awful number of games need such an app!It’s sooo good to see people still interested in ICE games. I played in the 80s & 90s, but I and my couple of friends were the only ones I knew of who did.
Honestly, every edition has been excellent but for one simple thing: paperwork. If there was a DDB type application that had all the rules, supplements, interactive character sheet, & dice roller, I’m fairly sure the games’ popularity would skyrocket.
Love the hell outta Rolemaster. Shadow World setting is MY ALL TIME TTRPG SETTING FaFaFaFAAAAAVE!!!!!My favorite rpg gets a bad rap. The edition I like isn't popular with some of the fan base. I think ICE pegged it at a 60 - 40 split at one point. And I've flame warred hard on the topic over the years because I think going back is regressive. Whatever my issues with the RMU (RM4e) project that I was part of for the first year, at least they're moving forward instead of crawling back. One thing I've maintained for a long time is that Rolemaster needs someone with vision at the helm, there needs to be a direction instead of endless dithering an division. That way we'd have something better to talk about than differences between editions.
For those who looked at the charts and bounced off without really giving RM a good long term campaign in which to shine I'll sum up the core of the system
Characters have attributes that give bonuses to skills. Each attribute has a temporary and potential rating and stats go up and occasionally down each level. Each profession pays a different price per rank of skill and a profession bonus to some skills. Races are balanced by access to background options like magic items, special skill bonuses, and money. Skill ranks give a +5 bonus up to rank ten then +3 for the next 10 ranks and so forth. Hit points are treated as a skill but have different progression rates based on the character's race. The core mechanic is d% open ended on 05- and 96+ + skill total with benchmarks for levels of success but with 110 being a full success.
Magic is purchased in spell lists which are divided into three core realms and one supplemental realm. There are Open, Closed, Evil, and Profession specific spell lists with each profession and realm having its own strengths, weaknesses, and unique specialties. You can cast spells above your level but with a much reduced chance of success. Monsters have a pretty brief, one line stat set, basically, level, movement, initiative, armor type, defense bonus, and attacks. It runs quite fluidly when you're organized, everyone should have the tables they need for their character because this is one game where they GM can't do it all.
Combat is: declare actions including the portion of weapon skill used to parry. The total is looked up on a weapon specific table which yields a number of hits and a critical hit level which is rolled on a chart by damage type. You can have a lot of hit points left and still wind up very dead. People get stunned and knocked down and wounds bleed here.
Experience is awarded for distance travelled, kills, spells cast, hits taken, hits given, crits taken, crits given, skills used, and ideas. Most people hate it, I love it, the secret is to use your scratch pad to figure it out between sessions.
I find it's a lot easier for D&D players to pick up than GURPS but GURPS is easier for new players to pick up than D&D or Rolemaster. I believe this is because Rolemaster is basically a percentile D&D variant with a strong dash of Tolkien.
Rolemaster First Edition was marketed as a supplement for D&D. Arms Law brought an advanced combat system. Spell Law brought a really neat magic system where magic is generally weaker but much more common place. If the master character table is to be believed, the average first level fighter has a +10 magic sword. Character Law brought the flexible character creation system where your mage can learn to use a sword even if it's really expensive for him to do so. There are around 20 core skills and a large number of optional secondary skills. Skills generally get the average of two stat bonuses but there are exceptions. The weapon tables and spell lists are hand written and printed on parchment. Ranks of "concussion hits" give a die type by race and size. Trolls are a viable player race. Spell lists are learned in five level blocks and it's quite possible to have a first level mage who doesn't know any spells.
Rolemaster Second Edition was unified as a system and integrated in a boxed set, the tables are type written, and the Angus McBride covers debut. RM2 was supported in a series of companions covering diverse topics. The text is small and dense and art minimal. RM2 also sees the publication of Spacemaster and a number of genre books for things like Robin Hood, pirates, and cowboys.
Rolemaster Standard System made some major changes, integrating options from the companions. Stats are now purchased with points and a maximum is randomly rolled based on the potential. Skills are grouped into categories which share a cost and receive bonuses from three stats but there are exceptions. There are a number of different skill progression rates. Hit and power points have fixed progression schemes by race. Categories and Skills have different progression rates as do "Combined" skills which don't really overlap or relate to each other (Black Smith and Cooking in the Crafts category). Background options are supplemented with Talents and Flaws. Instead of just handing out development points at first level and having a list of cultural hobby skills, RMSS has fixed cultural skill packages. It also has "Training Packages" like Knight or Apprentice Mage that make it easy to figure out what skills your character needs. RMSS was also supported with companions for all four magical realms of power and martial arts, Space Master Privateers, Black Ops, and Pulp Adventures.
For my own tastes, the rich texture of RMSS is pretty much unmatched in the industry. It's really good and there's nothing else quite like it. You know how they tell you you can't have things both ways? Well why limit yourself to a false binary like that?
I do think there are some problems with RMSS. First, the skill/ category split should have been optional. You should have been able to play with categories, skills, or both. I suspect forcing the 600 skill core one everyone was probably the most divisive mistake. Rolemaster is very modular, everything else is take it or leave it but the culture and training packages don't work if you drop the skill category split. Second, training packages get a discount and take time but they should also give experience points in direct proportion to the discount. This would mean that characters might level up in character creation but it would also fix the issue of stacked training packages massively exceeding first level skill limits. Also, over the years the discount went from a flat 3/4 to a weird sliding scale. It shouldn't have. There are no first level Navy Seals full stop. Spacemaster Privateers sees the training package system developing into a full on life path system. Which would be the way to go. Navy package plus special forces package equals Navy Seal.
And then ICE died in a Tolkien license related bankruptcy and was rescued by a British investor. Really, I hope he's had better luck with his other investments, but that's another story. I did my only published writing in the industry for the second incarnation of ICE. My "The Arcane Confabulation Rules" drew heavily on things I like about RMSS, almost none of them are found in RM2.
My opinion is to refine RMC or RMX, have RMSS add-ons, have a fun intro adventure, preferably in a core book, and make easy to run followup adventures that highlight RM in all its gruesome awesomeness. Rolemaster is supposed to look like a Tarantino movie with elves and lighting bolts. But hey, what do I know?
And that is exactly what we were aiming for -- using RMX as the basis for a revision (I even had the Open Beta version of it ready to release), with expansions that could take you into am RMSS-like game .
To be fair, that is kinda selfish thing to ask. That he should re-work all the stuff just to accommodate you. I too would have stopped inviting you over. Sorry.I suggested that the game would be easier, if all the numbers got divided by 5 and you rolled a D20 instead of D100. He got really angry about this for some reason.
I like him already! :pI've never been able to really like Rolemaster. Why, because in the 90's I met a Rolemaster fanatic. This guy would only run or play Rolemaster. This might not have been such a bad thing. But the edition he insisted on was The Standard System one, and he wasn't a good GM with it either.
I suggested that the game would be easier, if all the numbers got divided by 5 and you rolled a D20 instead of D100. He got really angry about this for some reason. After that, he stopped inviting me to his games.
Years later, I discovered other Rolemaster editions. But my experiences with him had ruined the game for me.
To be fair, that is kinda selfish thing to ask. That he should re-work all the stuff just to accommodate you. I too would have stopped inviting you over. Sorry.
I wasn't asking for it to happen. Quite frankly I didn't really care. It was just a suggestion, since he and some of the other players often struggled with the math. Even if he hadn't stopped inviting me, I would have quit the game anyway. He and I didn't really gel well together. So no need to be sorry.
Yeah I have to say when people say math is hard in relation to all but a very select few RPGs it actually makes me worry about our collective education systems. Exponentiation, ok I can see people not remembering that.I've never gotten the whole 'math is hard' thing about Rolemaster combat- it's simple addition and subtraction. There's some in character creation, but really only if you use alternate rules does it get anywhere near heavy.
I saw a GURPS player say the same thing yesterday...Yeah I have to say when people say math is hard in relation to all but a very select few RPGs it actually makes me worry about our collective education systems.
The rules may have got smoothed out with subsequent editions, although I felt the books started feeling more bland as the editions progressed.
Yeah, removing declaration of intent pretty much destroys the combat system. There`s the one guy who always used to complain about how parrying was pointless. I also think that`s one of the reasons Rolemaster gets a bad rap, lots of gamers tossed out declaration of intent in D&D with no ill effects and think it's meaningless elsewhere. But in Rolemaster everyone can roll their initiative and attacks at the same time instead of one after the other and that's what makes all the difference.Anyone else have any thoughts on that?
I really like Against the Darkmaster too. It helps that they allow themselves to work in a few more mechanics to really nail the feel of the type of fantasy fiction they're out to emulate (not just Lord of the Rings, but a lot of the 1980s imitators like Terry Brooks' stuff), rather than following the MERP approach of essentially just offering "Rolemaster, but less of it" (though as far as condensed edits of Rolemaster to fit a particular setting go MERP isn't bad).If I run an ICE-system game again, it's not likely to be RM or HARP actually. It will be Against The Darkmaster, which uses MERP as the foundation, but it ticks alot of the classic fantasy vibe I liked from both MERP and RM, making the game feel nostaligic yet fresh at the same time. The more recent ICE books like RM Express and HARP just don't capture that vibe for me, even if the mechanics are good. The Against The Darkmaster book grabs me like MERP and RM did back in the 1980s, it's more aesthetics than anything, but if itworks it works.
I really liked the vibe of Middle Earth. Sure it doesn't capture some of the inteinsic elements of the setting, but it was a very detailed fantasy setting all the same. So was RM's Shadow World, but MERP moreso.I really like Against the Darkmaster too. It helps that they allow themselves to work in a few more mechanics to really nail the feel of the type of fantasy fiction they're out to emulate (not just Lord of the Rings, but a lot of the 1980s imitators like Terry Brooks' stuff), rather than following the MERP approach of essentially just offering "Rolemaster, but less of it" (though as far as condensed edits of Rolemaster to fit a particular setting go MERP isn't bad).
I really liked the vibe of Middle Earth. Sure it doesn't capture some of the inteinsic elements of the setting, but it was a very detailed fantasy setting all the same. So was RM's Shadow World, but MERP moreso.
Regarding RM, I was not like my friends baxk then who thought having detailed weapon charts for every weapon was cool. I was happy with the broad charts that were in the other ICE games like MERP, Cyberspace, and later, HARP.
They still feel very much the ICE system, although I thought that RM was overly-granular (which was the sign of a 'serious' rpg at the time).
Against The Darkmaster does well with using the MERP mechanics as the mainframe, as I think that is about as far one should go with granularity anyway
The finished product of Against the Darkmaster is a work of art to behold, and I'm eager to test drive it
[ . . . ]A couple of things I do remember was at some point it felt like magic items and dice rolls were more important than actual character abilities but it is certainly possible that it was due to the play style of the GM.