Talislanta for 5E D&D

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AsenRG

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Sure you have. They seem like they know the rules, but when push comes to shove...
Nope, still haven't met them! Those that know the rules, learn them because they like rules, like many of us...:shade:

And if there's no pressure to learn them, those that don't want to, don't feel the need to pretend having learned them:grin:!

Amusingly, I've encountered the kind of people you refer to way more often in games with much less mechanic. Though it was usually a case of "haven't thought through the implications of those mechanics":thumbsup:.
 

Imaginos

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First, so excited for this to happen. Love me some Talislanta, particularly if it is dual-stats like they did. They need to learn a bit more about the 5E side, but that's no big issue (speaking here of Thrall background: Tattoo).

Second, I absolutely hate the way Facebook works. I'm in that group. I've not been seeing notifications.
 

Silverlion

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I'm also very happy to see a dual-statted version with the gorgeous art. I hate the fact I'll be paying fundamentally for more 5E content than Tal content. However, I've got 4E so I'm well off with that. Still, it could be worse.
 

AsenRG

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I'm also very happy to see a dual-statted version with the gorgeous art. I hate the fact I'll be paying fundamentally for more 5E content than Tal content. However, I've got 4E so I'm well off with that. Still, it could be worse.
Yeah, I agree. So much wasted space that could have been used for setting:thumbsup:!
 

Mankcam

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Rather than dual-statted, I would just prefer they bring out separate TAL and D&D 5E editions.
 

Bunch

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Rather than dual-statted, I would just prefer they bring out separate TAL and D&D 5E editions.
I would have bought them both so this should save me some shelf space.
 

Savage Schemer

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No, that was the Savage Land's kickstarter. The one we're all awaiting is the classic setting updated to 5e and dual statted with classic rules. The Savage Land did in fact have multiple rules versions though. Of course, I went with Talislanta rules. Everything else is heresy.
 

Rogerdee

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No, that was the Savage Land's kickstarter. The one we're all awaiting is the classic setting updated to 5e and dual statted with classic rules. The Savage Land did in fact have multiple rules versions though. Of course, I went with Talislanta rules. Everything else is heresy.
Apologies, my bad on getting the wrong thing.
Aren't the original rules the Omni system?
 

Savage Schemer

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Apologies, my bad on getting the wrong thing.
Aren't the original rules the Omni system?
Talislanta came first and I've been in conversations with Stephan Michael Sechi where he refers to it as the "Talislanta engine" or "Original rules" and so I tend to do the same. The Omni rules were basically the same, only in an attempt to turn it into a generic all-purpose rules engine. Jerry Grayson has done much the same with his so-called "Omega System", with crunch layered on top, and six or eight additional layers of crunch added on top of that for good measure. Jerry loves his crunch.

But, yeah, they're all essentially the same at the core.
 

TNMalt

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True. But Jerry did good work with Atlantis and Hellas. Yes I did the 'take my money' with those
 

Savage Schemer

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True. But Jerry did good work with Atlantis and Hellas. Yes I did the 'take my money' with those
Oh, I did the same! But one doesn't buy a Jerry Grayson game expecting him to embrace a rules-lite philosophy :grin:
 

TNMalt

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I don't mind the crunch. Cause sometimes you need the crunch to keep everyone on the same page.
 

Arminius

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When it comes to Talislanta, I prefer the more old-school, D&D-derived structure found in 1e-3e. Key elements are escalating hit points and skills by level (with the option to concentrate on a skill), and spells that are described concretely. In 4e, the system became more skill based, combat introduced defense rolls (IIRC), and spells became effects-based.

Somehow I think 5th edition (the Morrigan one) is supposed to have walked some of that back but I never looked at it closely.

I wonder which branch this will follow. I’m guessing it will continue from 5th.
 

Savage Schemer

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I'm not so sure. The Savage Land was a mix of 2e and 4e and, while I can't recall precisely where I saw it, I saw a "sample" page for the Thrall that made it look like they were going for something closer to what TSL did. Given that TSL didn't officially have magic, we can only speculate what they'll do but I'm hopeful that they go back to discreet spells. While I usually like effect-based magic systems, the discreet spells just "fit" Talislanta better in my opinion and give your spell casters ample reason to get out of the library and into the ruins.
 

Silverlion

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I'm not so sure. The Savage Land was a mix of 2e and 4e and, while I can't recall precisely where I saw it, I saw a "sample" page for the Thrall that made it look like they were going for something closer to what TSL did. Given that TSL didn't officially have magic, we can only speculate what they'll do but I'm hopeful that they go back to discreet spells. While I usually like effect-based magic systems, the discreet spells just "fit" Talislanta better in my opinion and give your spell casters ample reason to get out of the library and into the ruins.
I completely disagree, I felt it was a leap forward from the generic fixed spells of many of the previous editions that almost always felt bland (Oh look they get a magic attack that does X, and this one has one that also does X differently but really mechanically the same.) Though admittedly I've not used anything but 4E in ages upon ages.
 

Arminius

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I agree that the spells in the earlier edition were rather bland, especially in their core effect. Like there’s a fire bolt that does X damage and then a water bolt that does X and a blast of air that does X. (My memory is hazy on the exact details.) But the principle was there, which could be expanded on, that each spell was a real spell. And even in the case of the “bland” spells, they were concrete and I don’t think anyone could argue that the fire bolt wouldn’t set things on fire. By contrast the 4e system basically said if you want to use fire to attack and to do stuff to the environment, you needed to use different “modes”.
 

Spartan

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No, that was the Savage Land's kickstarter. The one we're all awaiting is the classic setting updated to 5e and dual statted with classic rules. The Savage Land did in fact have multiple rules versions though. Of course, I went with Talislanta rules. Everything else is heresy.
I got all three versions. Because reasons.
 

Dropbear

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Just for those interested, and because I don’t see it mentioned here yet…

Recent (fairly) Fb posts have shown page layout in the works, and the displayed Thrall has both 5E and classic Action Table stats.

I was considering crowdfunding it simply because Steve Sechi’s a friend and I’m a fan of his works since Compleat & Arcanum days, but was really dismayed about 5E Talislanta. Now I’m ecstatic. It has been confirmed that the new Tal will not be solely 5E. Which is good for me since my hat of E5 know no limit.
 

Rogerdee

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Why they have to sully good games with the D&D system is beyond me.
Because 5e is pretty hot shit right now, with so many different settings coming out for it.
Plus I am guessing they think it will sell more due to the brand.
But I could be wrong....
 

TNMalt

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5E is the gateway drug to other systems right now. Have to get them hooked first.
 

Dropbear

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Because 5e is pretty hot shit right now, with so many different settings coming out for it.
Plus I am guessing they think it will sell more due to the brand.
But I could be wrong....
This is the reason EPIC Everthing gave. To sell. Also, bring new fans to Talislanta.

However, as I mentioned previously, the books will be dual statted.

Great for existing fans, something new for possible new fans. I’ll never run it with 5E, I’ve already had all the look I need to know that. Thralls are statted out as a Barbarian. Ugh to me, I have despised the Rage-based Barbarian class since 3.0.
 

Rogerdee

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This is the reason EPIC Everthing gave. To sell. Also, bring new fans to Talislanta.

However, as I mentioned previously, the books will be dual statted.

Great for existing fans, something new for possible new fans. I’ll never run it with 5E, I’ve already had all the look I need to know that. Thralls are statted out as a Barbarian. Ugh to me, I have despised the Rage-based Barbarian class since 3.0.

I am agreement there. Plus the Bard has always pissed me off something rotten. A wizard spends years learning magic but a Bard just toots on his trumpet. How silly.

Honestly I am working on a point based system for 5e at the moment, my aim to replace a lot of powers of the classes with abilities more akin to Legendary / Heroic Abilities from Runequest and Gurps Martial Arts.

Then anyone that wants magic would purchase that separately. WiP at the moment though.
 

Arminius

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I had gotten TSL but I never looked at it until now. In my opinion the writing and presentation are quite good. So that bodes pretty well for this new edition, given it’ll now include the “original” system. I still wonder how spells will be handled. D&D’s spell lists are one of its strong points (though I’m not familiar with 5e)—basically, using the D&D spell descriptions to replace or supplement the ones in Tal could be pretty nice.
 

Dropbear

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Isn't at least half the point of Talislanta that it isn't D&D? I think I hate this. I'm not certain, but ...

No, I'm sure. I hate this.
FWIW, the original Talislanta Action Table rules will be supported as well. I believe I have mentioned that, and how thrilled I am about it, a few times now ;)

What this new edition will add to the original game besides a timeline change, and with that a sociopolitical change (The Nine Kingdoms) and 5e mechanics has yet to be determined…

Since Savage Lands didn’t deal with anything more than very primitive magic, I’m wondering which direction they will go with higher magic. The extremely fiddly 4E rules, or the slightly more streamlined 5E rules, or something else?

I wouldn’t say I hate it yet, but I am not sure how much money I will pour into it . I’m bound to see more previews as it gets closer to the KS date. I can make up my mind with time.
 

Dropbear

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I had gotten TSL but I never looked at it until now. In my opinion the writing and presentation are quite good. So that bodes pretty well for this new edition, given it’ll now include the “original” system. I still wonder how spells will be handled. D&D’s spell lists are one of its strong points (though I’m not familiar with 5e)—basically, using the D&D spell descriptions to replace or supplement the ones in Tal could be pretty nice.
1st - 3rd edition had spell lists. 4E’s spell construction kit was interesting but a little too much for my tastes tbh.
 

Dropbear

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Dropbear Dropbear Oh, what’s changing about the timeline and sociopolitical situation?
There are Nine Kingdoms instead of Seven. Danuvia has been destroyed by beastmen and the survivors integrated with Cymril’s kingdom group. I forget the Ninth Kingdom atm. Have to look again at what was said And the new map.
 

opaopajr

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Talislanta (I tried 1e) is a cool system and world. It'd be nice if the new kids 'discover' a new treasure. Though setting changes always leave me nervous. Leave that to adventures, please! They are more optional and less prone to canon fracturing.
 

Dropbear

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I
Talislanta (I tried 1e) is a cool system and world. It'd be nice if the new kids 'discover' a new treasure. Though setting changes always leave me nervous. Leave that to adventures, please! They are more optional and less prone to canon fracturing.
i Dunno, I kinda expect something to change with every new edition of Talislanta. I mean, there have been at least minor setting changes with all of the editions. The largest were in 3rd edition, and then 4th edition.
 

opaopajr

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I Dunno, I kinda expect something to change with every new edition of Talislanta. I mean, there have been at least minor setting changes with all of the editions. The largest were in 3rd edition, and then 4th edition.
I just don't more want metaplot or setting nukes. And given Talislanta has like 5 other continents beyond the main one that I don't remember getting much attention, I'd rather the game explores that. Like if Forgotten Realms actually fleshed out Ossé or Katashaka (or Rokugan fleshed out Yodatai or Ivory Kingdoms) instead of going through another storyline power shuffle or full blown apocalypse.
 

Dropbear

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I just don't more want metaplot or setting nukes. And given Talislanta has like 5 other continents beyond the main one that I don't remember getting much attention, I'd rather the game explores that. Like if Forgotten Realms actually fleshed out Ossé or Katashaka (or Rokugan fleshed out Yodatai or Ivory Kingdoms) instead of going through another storyline power shuffle or full blown apocalypse.
I understand. I wasn’t a huge fan of 4e’s changes derived from Jon Harper’s Talislanta campaign myself. I still use the Quan Empire in my games.
 
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