What do you think are the most damaging ideas in the hobby?

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Brock Savage

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See, my thought is also like "you want to risk it, give me a sleight of hand check to hide the somatic components, and a bluff check to hide the verbal ones". (which for some social spells may still be worth it to try, especially on like an arcane trickster or bard who has high sleight of hand/bluff).
See this is a great example of how seemingly small judgement calls can have deep implications that make campaigns unique. I want to be clear I am not saying "you're doing it wrong"- quite the opposite!

In my games the vast majority of casting is obvious. I also imagine the "mystic chanting" and "forceful gestures" required for spellcasting are precise. Furthermore, since subtle spell casting is a Sorcerer class feature I wouldn't give it away for free with a skill check. That said, if a player really wanted to circumvent verbal or somatic requirements I would probably work with them to enable it through acquiring a feat, class ability, special familiar or item. Off the top of my head I would probably invoke an alien bloodline through a feat or class ability:

Innate Sorcery
Your inhuman ancestry allows you to cast spells innately. When you cast a spell, you may cast it without any somatic or verbal components. You can use this feature up to three times between long rests.
 

Black Leaf

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Right? That's my view as well. Though I think I'm more of it just being 18+ with no upper limit. The under 18 would be fine, I just don't feel like dealing with any minors parents. That's unfortunately where you run into more issues than any potential immaturity of the player.
For me it's even more practical. I'm used to gaming in pubs. That said, I have had a then 16 year old in my LARP, but that was an explicit exception because I already knew his family.
 

Ravenswing

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The issue is that because there's a specific spell that says something like "in addition, this spell can set things on fire", and so, naturally, the assumption by some players and DMs is that NO OTHER SPELLS CAN.

One of the very last times I played D&D, back in the 70s – and one of the seminal events which soured me on the system – was in playing a wizard in some forgotten campaign. We were fighting the Big Bad, and the fighter with the Destined Sword of Big Bad Slaying was dropped. Destined Sword of Big Bad Slaying fell to the ground, and the Big Bad turned to engage other people. So there I am, without useful spells remaining, the Big Bad's paying no attention to me ... and the DSoBBS is sitting there on the ground.

I rub my chin, and tell the DM I pick up the sword and clobber the Big Bad with it. You can't do that, says he.

Look, say I, I get I've no training in using a sword. I don't figure I can hit him smart, and I don't figure I can hit him hard, and I may well just hit a glancing blow or otherwise do a mediocre job of it, but he's got his freaking back to me, and this has to be about as hard a task to conceptualize as chopping wood. I pick the sword up, I raise it with a two-handed death grip, and I do a baseball swing at the Big Bad's back.

You can't do that, says he.

What do you mean "I can't do that?" asks I. I wrap my hands around that there hilt. I take some care not to cut myself on that sharp edged part (it's not that there's some asinine class restriction preventing wizards from using kitchen knives to cut meat without slicing themselves up, after all). I raise it over my head. Want me to go home, get my broadsword out of my closet, and show you how an untrained college kid would manage these physical actions?

You can't do that, repeats he.

Does the sword physically vanish? No. Does it skitter away from my hand? No. It's not that my magical powers will vanish forever if I touch it, because I was the guy who FOUND the damn thing in the first place, right ... ?

And half way through my rant, I just stopped, muttered "Fuck it" or something similar, picked up my dice and left.
 

Stan

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Any 21st century D&D handles that; you'd have a penalty to hit. That wizard could also wear armor if they didn't mind having trouble doing things. But spells doing only exactly what they say is more 21st century.
 

Fenris-77

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One of the very last times I played D&D, back in the 70s – and one of the seminal events which soured me on the system – was in playing a wizard in some forgotten campaign. We were fighting the Big Bad, and the fighter with the Destined Sword of Big Bad Slaying was dropped. Destined Sword of Big Bad Slaying fell to the ground, and the Big Bad turned to engage other people. So there I am, without useful spells remaining, the Big Bad's paying no attention to me ... and the DSoBBS is sitting there on the ground.

I rub my chin, and tell the DM I pick up the sword and clobber the Big Bad with it. You can't do that, says he.

Look, say I, I get I've no training in using a sword. I don't figure I can hit him smart, and I don't figure I can hit him hard, and I may well just hit a glancing blow or otherwise do a mediocre job of it, but he's got his freaking back to me, and this has to be about as hard a task to conceptualize as chopping wood. I pick the sword up, I raise it with a two-handed death grip, and I do a baseball swing at the Big Bad's back.

You can't do that, says he.

What do you mean "I can't do that?" asks I. I wrap my hands around that there hilt. I take some care not to cut myself on that sharp edged part (it's not that there's some asinine class restriction preventing wizards from using kitchen knives to cut meat without slicing themselves up, after all). I raise it over my head. Want me to go home, get my broadsword out of my closet, and show you how an untrained college kid would manage these physical actions?

You can't do that, repeats he.

Does the sword physically vanish? No. Does it skitter away from my hand? No. It's not that my magical powers will vanish forever if I touch it, because I was the guy who FOUND the damn thing in the first place, right ... ?

And half way through my rant, I just stopped, muttered "Fuck it" or something similar, picked up my dice and left.
The short answer there is that that DM is a fucking idiot who shouldn't be let anywhere near an actual gaming table.
 

TristramEvans

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The Wheels on the Bus go Round and Round

She Bop

Turning Japanese

It's Raining Men

I was going to say Walk like an Egyptian but I see it's already there.

More seriously: The Sound of Silence, Eyes without a face, Blister In the Sun, Invisible, Comfortably Numb, Under a Blood-Red Sky.

Blister in the Sun and Comfortably Numb I already had, but Sound of Silence and Eyes Without a Face are great - I've noted them for future inclusion

I considered She Bop, but I'm afraid I can't separate that song title from it's subject now that I know what it's about
 

Silverlion

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And that is why I prefer detailed systems that nail things down.
One of the very last times I played D&D, back in the 70s – and one of the seminal events which soured me on the system – was in playing a wizard in some forgotten campaign. We were fighting the Big Bad, and the fighter with the Destined Sword of Big Bad Slaying was dropped. Destined Sword of Big Bad Slaying fell to the ground, and the Big Bad turned to engage other people. So there I am, without useful spells remaining, the Big Bad's paying no attention to me ... and the DSoBBS is sitting there on the ground.

I rub my chin, and tell the DM I pick up the sword and clobber the Big Bad with it. You can't do that, says he.

Look, say I, I get I've no training in using a sword. I don't figure I can hit him smart, and I don't figure I can hit him hard, and I may well just hit a glancing blow or otherwise do a mediocre job of it, but he's got his freaking back to me, and this has to be about as hard a task to conceptualize as chopping wood. I pick the sword up, I raise it with a two-handed death grip, and I do a baseball swing at the Big Bad's back.

You can't do that, says he.
ft.

Totally would have allowed it because it would have been AWESOME! (Mind you I wasn't playing until 1980-81ish)
 

Ravenswing

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Oh come on! It's Raining Men is really a great spell. A bit messy but absolutely crushing to enemy morale.

It's a hell of a lot better than a DM at the Grenadier Club at UMass in the 80s, who cried out with great glee at the next table over that his Big Bad was inundating the party with a "Rain of Molten SMEGMA!!!" (Emphasis decidedly his. I am not making this one up either, gods help me.)

If ever there was a college student destined to become a neckbeard Cat Piss Man ...
 

AsenRG

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One of the very last times I played D&D, back in the 70s – and one of the seminal events which soured me on the system – was in playing a wizard in some forgotten campaign. We were fighting the Big Bad, and the fighter with the Destined Sword of Big Bad Slaying was dropped. Destined Sword of Big Bad Slaying fell to the ground, and the Big Bad turned to engage other people. So there I am, without useful spells remaining, the Big Bad's paying no attention to me ... and the DSoBBS is sitting there on the ground.

I rub my chin, and tell the DM I pick up the sword and clobber the Big Bad with it. You can't do that, says he.

Look, say I, I get I've no training in using a sword. I don't figure I can hit him smart, and I don't figure I can hit him hard, and I may well just hit a glancing blow or otherwise do a mediocre job of it, but he's got his freaking back to me, and this has to be about as hard a task to conceptualize as chopping wood. I pick the sword up, I raise it with a two-handed death grip, and I do a baseball swing at the Big Bad's back.

You can't do that, says he.

What do you mean "I can't do that?" asks I. I wrap my hands around that there hilt. I take some care not to cut myself on that sharp edged part (it's not that there's some asinine class restriction preventing wizards from using kitchen knives to cut meat without slicing themselves up, after all). I raise it over my head. Want me to go home, get my broadsword out of my closet, and show you how an untrained college kid would manage these physical actions?

You can't do that, repeats he.

Does the sword physically vanish? No. Does it skitter away from my hand? No. It's not that my magical powers will vanish forever if I touch it, because I was the guy who FOUND the damn thing in the first place, right ... ?

And half way through my rant, I just stopped, muttered "Fuck it" or something similar, picked up my dice and left.
He did you a favour, I guess. After all, you went on to find better games after that, didn't you:grin:?
 

Nobby-W

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I considered She Bop, but I'm afraid I can't separate that song title from it's subject now that I know what it's about
That was the point ...

When did you find out what it was about?
 

Necrozius

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I considered She Bop, but I'm afraid I can't separate that song title from it's subject now that I know what it's about
Pretty sure Raggi found a similar song or theme for one of the spells in his “Vaginas are Magic” book.
 

Necrozius

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Cyndi Lauper holds an odd place in my memory. I first really saw her in the music video "Good Enough" for the Goonies movie. As a small kid, that film royally creeped me out.

The idea that in any benign suburban house there could be a secret passage into a dungeon full of traps, skeletons and mobsters chasing you (yeah yeah I know that in the movie the passage was under a remote restaurant, not in someone's house, but in the music video it WAS!). So I thought she was real pretty but that was mixed with the fear of the underground pirate thing and...

WWF wrestlers around just because?

Cyndi Lauper is basically the quintessential 80s media nostalgia fairy.
 

TristramEvans

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WWF wrestlers around just because?

Oh, definitely not "just because", Cyndi Lauper was heavily involved in Wrestling


 

robiswrong

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Once upon a time I caused a project manager to re-evaluate his childhood by sharing this with him.

I feel that punking the industry and getting it onto the charts in 1983 was Cyndi Lauper's crowning achievement.
I did a birthday show a few years ago, and the band I was in that was all dudes and named "Dongle" covered it.

So awesome.
 

Necrozius

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Oh, definitely not "just because", Cyndi Lauper was heavily involved in Wrestling


I had NO IDEA!! It just seemed so random in the music video HAHAHAHA
 

Lofgeornost

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I have a master list of all the ones I've detailed so far. Mostly I ended up looking for song titles that, when I read them in this new context, immdiately suggested or inspired a spell or effect

The Advent of Panurge

After Forever

All the World is Green

All Through the Night

All Tomorrow’s Parties

Another Brick in the Wall

Any Colour You Like

Arriving Somewhere But Not Here

As The World Falls Down

Ashes to Ashes

Astronomy Domine

Back in Black

The Beast

Beloved Freak

Birdhouse in Your Soul

Bliss

Blister in the Sun

Blood Roses

Bloodletting

Bouncing Off Clouds

Breaking Up the Girl

Broken Arrow

Bullet with Butterfly Wings

Calm Inside the Storm

Candy Says

Caught a Light Sneeze

Caught in a Dream

Cemetery Polka

Change of Heart

Children of the Grave

Children of the Sea

Cities in Dust

Close My Eyes Forever

Cloud on my Tongue

Cold as Ice

Cold Cold Ground

Comfortably Numb

Control

Court of the Crimson King

Cracked Actor

The Creeps

Dance Along the Edge

Darkening of the Light

Dazed and Confused

Dazzle

The Day That Never Comes

Dead and Lovely

Dead Man’s Party

Demon Fire

Diamond Dogs

Dirt in the Ground

Down The Reeperbahn

Echoes

Electric Funeral

Empty

Enter Sandman

Every Rose Has its Thorn

Every Shade of Blue

Every Thing You Can Think

Eye of the Tiger

Face to Face

Fade to Black

Fairies Wear Boots

Father Lucifer

Feed My Frankenstein

Feelings of Forever

The First Rebreather

Flesh n’ Blood

Flower’s Grave

Fool’s Overture

For Whom the Bell Tolls

Gates of Delirium

Giant’s Rolling Pin

God is a Bullet

Godhead

Goodbye Blue Sky

Halo of Flies

Happy House

Hard as a Rock

Harvester of Sorrow

Head Like a Hole

Heart of the Sunrise

Hearts Never Lie

Hell Broke Luce

Hell’s Bells

Hey Jupiter

High Voltage

Hole in the Sky

Hungry Like the Wolf

I Talk to the Wind

Icicle

If I Close My Eyes Forever

I’m Set Free

Insecurious

Into the Light

Into the Nightlife

Into the Void

Jigsaw Feeling

Just Like You Imagined

The Killing Jar

Kiss in the Dreamhouse

Kiss Them for Me

Kommienezuspaedt

Lady Godiva’s Operation

Learning to Fly

Little Earthquakes

Lord of this World

Love Hurts

Love in a Void

Lullabye

Master of Puppets

The Memory Remains

Mittageisen

Moonage Daydream

Moonchild

Moth Into Flame

Neon Knights

Night Shift

Nine Feet Undergound

No Leaf Clover

No More Tears

No One Knows I'm Gone

No Spill Blood

Nothing Else Matters

On the Outside

1000 Oceans

Only Happy When it Rains

Ordinary Man

Painted Bird

Past the Mission

Pigs on the Wing

A Plague of Lighthouse Keepers

Precious Things

Pretty Hate Machine

Pull Out the Pin

Raspberry Swirl

Red Light

Reeperbahn

Right Between the Eyes

Road to Nowhere

Ruby’s Arms

Run Run Run

Sabbra Cadabra

Scene of a Perfect Crime

See You on the Other Side

Shadow of the Heirophant

Shadowboxer

Shoot to Thrill

Silent All These Years

The Sky is a Poisonous Garden

Slowdive

Snowblind

Song from the Edge of the World

A Sorta Fairytale

Sour Times

Spark

Spellbound

Strong Black Vine

Switch

Tainted Love

Teaching Little Fingers to Play

Tear in Your Hand

Temptation Waits

There She Goes

The Thing That Should Not Be

This City Will Kill You

This Wheel’s on Fire

Thunderstruck

Time After Time

Time Will Crawl

Total Eclipse of the Heart

Trouble’s Lament

True Colours

Twilight Zone

Under the Graveyard

Under the Ivy

The Underfall Yard

Undone

The Unforgiven

Unrepentant Geraldines

Until it Sleeps

Venus in Furs

Vow

Walk Like an Egyptian

The Wall

Watch Her Disappear

Way Down in the Hole

Welcome to the Machine

We're All Mad Here

Wheels of Confusion

Who Made Who?

The Width of a Circle

Wild is the Wind

The World is Stone

Wuthering Heights

Yesterday is Here

Some others that occur to me:
  • Money for Nothing
  • Good Vibrations
  • Everbody's Got Something to Hide (Except Me and My Monkey)
  • Watching the Detectives
  • Refuge of the Roads
  • Whiter Shade of Pale
And, if you're willing to extend the chronological range a bit:
  • Hell-hound on My Trail
  • Don't You Roll Those Bloodshot Eyes at Me
Edit: how can I forget:
  • Spirits in the Material World
  • Any King's Shilling
  • Bar-room Blitz
 
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xanther

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The short answer there is that that DM is a fucking idiot who shouldn't be let anywhere near an actual gaming table.
You'd think but there is a whole forum (IIRC) where you'd be "schooled" otherwise. The wizard using a sword (edit: controversy) in D&D is almost as the old as the game...sure have some Dragon letter to the editor or Sage advice or some such from '77 about it, certainly their may be a co-creator screed somewhere. :smile:
 
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Gabriel

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One of the very last times I played D&D, back in the 70s – and one of the seminal events which soured me on the system – was in playing a wizard in some forgotten campaign. We were fighting the Big Bad, and the fighter with the Destined Sword of Big Bad Slaying was dropped. Destined Sword of Big Bad Slaying fell to the ground, and the Big Bad turned to engage other people. So there I am, without useful spells remaining, the Big Bad's paying no attention to me ... and the DSoBBS is sitting there on the ground.

I rub my chin, and tell the DM I pick up the sword and clobber the Big Bad with it. You can't do that, says he.

Look, say I, I get I've no training in using a sword. I don't figure I can hit him smart, and I don't figure I can hit him hard, and I may well just hit a glancing blow or otherwise do a mediocre job of it, but he's got his freaking back to me, and this has to be about as hard a task to conceptualize as chopping wood. I pick the sword up, I raise it with a two-handed death grip, and I do a baseball swing at the Big Bad's back.

You can't do that, says he.

What do you mean "I can't do that?" asks I. I wrap my hands around that there hilt. I take some care not to cut myself on that sharp edged part (it's not that there's some asinine class restriction preventing wizards from using kitchen knives to cut meat without slicing themselves up, after all). I raise it over my head. Want me to go home, get my broadsword out of my closet, and show you how an untrained college kid would manage these physical actions?

You can't do that, repeats he.

Does the sword physically vanish? No. Does it skitter away from my hand? No. It's not that my magical powers will vanish forever if I touch it, because I was the guy who FOUND the damn thing in the first place, right ... ?

And half way through my rant, I just stopped, muttered "Fuck it" or something similar, picked up my dice and left.

Reading this, I wonder if the problem was really adherence to the Rule or if it was really about how your character in specific wasn't supposed to be the Destined one to use the Destined Sword of Big Bad Slaying. More often than not, when I've seen that sort of thing happen, the Rule was just an excuse. The real reason was that no one else was supposed to steal the thunder from the GM's close friends or one-up the GMPC.
 

Nobby-W

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I have no idea. I discovered the video same as you're watching it

According to the interwebs it was done for an exhibition at the Tate Modern about a decade or so ago.


It was done by an artist called Takashi Murakami, who seems to be a prominent figure in Japanese fine arts. It looks like he does a fair amount of stuff with Lichtenstein/Warhol-ish pop art type themes if you look at other work he's done.


Funnily enough, Jeff Koons was another artist that comes to mind, and he seems to get compared to Koons quite a bit.
 
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Ladybird

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You'd think but there is a whole forum (IIRC) where you'd be "schooled" otherwise. The wizard using a sword in D&D is almost as the old as the game...sure have some Dragon letter to the editor or Sage advice or some such from '77 about it, certainly their may be a co-creator screed somewhere. :smile:
Even just using the 1974 rules, the solution is obvious - the wizzie rolls to hit as a first-level wizard, regardless of their actual level, and maybe with a -1 penalty on top if I was feeling harsh. Easy.
 

zanshin

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Someone just died in our last session of 5e.

I don't recall 1e being particularly deadly, I never found D&D in general that lethal.

The real high lethality in CoC and CP2020 was one of the things I found refreshing playing them after years of playing B/X, 1e and 2e D&D.
It's why first aid is an essential GM skill, players don't die on my watch.

(Characters on the other hand ;) )
 
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