What’s a critically acclaimed RPG you don’t like?

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Allen Varney said:
Though my days as PARANOIA line developer are long past (2004-2006), I still like to check into statements of this kind. When was the last time you looked at the line?
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Back in the 80s. It's been a while.
 
Ladybird said:
They switched from using d20 to using 3d6. I don't consider that a huge innovation in and of itself. Similarly, I don't consider the use of the "stunt die" and the associated stunt points table to be doing anything that a degrees of success mechanic (Similar to that of Pathfinder 2e, passing / failing a roll by 10 or more is a critical) doesn't do more elegantly.
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Degree of success have huge issues with progression unless you keep on top of the numbers. Stunt Dice in contrast doesn't break just because you gain +umpteenth bonus in a skill. From a designer's standpoint they are their own mechanic with a specific set of odds. A lot easier to tweak than the degree of success systems I played with.
 
CRKrueger said:
A 2d6 system plus Stunt Die is descended from 3.x? Are you talking about the Talents? I chalk that up to cRPG roots more than D&D.
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To me AGE looks like an evolution from 3.X via True20. With a lot of emphasis placed on talents i.e. feats. Although I don't view its heritage as a negative aside from the hit point issue. I have my own take on the general idea in a rough draft form (not the science fiction variant I came up with).
 
Allen Varney said:
Sure sure. I've encountered feedback from many gamers who formed strong opinions about PARANOIA during the second Reagan Administration and never felt a need to look at the game in the next three decades.
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Not sure how to parse that remark. But I will say that maybe I should have at least made it clear in my previous post I was talking in past tense about a distant exposure to the material.
 
Allen Varney said:
Sure sure. I've encountered feedback from many gamers who formed strong opinions about PARANOIA during the second Reagan Administration and never felt a need to look at the game in the next three decades.
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I've actually had far more success running straightish Paranoia with newer roleplayers for that reason. They don't come with the same preconceptions about what Paranoia is.
 
Gabriel said:
Come to think of it, Paranoia is another one that I don't like. I think it takes a potentially cool concept, and it just tosses it into a pit of brain dead "gamer humor."
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Gabriel said:
I will say that maybe I should have at least made it clear in my previous post I was talking in past tense about a distant exposure to the material.
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Sorry, I'd missed the past tense.
 
Nobby-W said:
I've not tried Natto, although it's on my hit list if I ever get back to Japan.
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As an adventurous eater who worked in and managed restaurants owned by Japanese nationals for the better part of a decade, take it from me: natto is fucking disgusting. And I have a reputation as a guy who'll eat anything.
 
robertsconley said:
To me AGE looks like an evolution from 3.X via True20. With a lot of emphasis placed on talents i.e. feats. Although I don't view its heritage as a negative aside from the hit point issue. I have my own take on the general idea in a rough draft form (not the science fiction variant I came up with).
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I agree on this, especially with Modern AGE as it dumps classes. With the options to fix the HP issue, I actually find I quite like the system, though it isn't one of my favorites.
 
robertsconley said:
The major flaw in AGE is the hit point bloat. The skill advancement system I think is too coarse as well but otherwise it is a great system and it now has official options to deal with the hit point situation.
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On AGE, if we're talking about Green Ronin's system. They've got rules mechanics for grittier game play where hit point bloat isn't an issue at all. You can find rules for it in Modern Age, World of Lazarus and I believe the Expanse setting as well. You can choose different levels of grittiness throughout as GM.
 
Acmegamer said:
On AGE, if we're talking about Green Ronin's system. They've got rules mechanics for grittier game play where hit point bloat isn't an issue at all. You can find rules for it in Modern Age, World of Lazarus and I believe the Expanse setting as well. You can choose different levels of grittiness throughout as GM.
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Yes I am aware. And I was talking about the Green Ronin RPG.
 
Allen Varney said:
Sure sure. I've encountered feedback from many gamers who formed strong opinions about PARANOIA during the second Reagan Administration and never felt a need to look at the game in the next three decades.
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I have a copy of Paranoia XP that I used for one-shots when my group got sick of oWoD, Nobilis, and Shadowrun. The biggest complaint we had was that one player wanted to play a Marx Brother, another thought we were doing "1984, only funny," and a third just wanted to see how many different ways she could get her clones killed. One session of that was enough to clear out the pipes for our more usual gaming.

I'm not sure if that's meant as a complaint or a compliment.
 
My own personal list of critically acclaimed/popular rpgs that I don't like or bounce off are the following and the reasons why.

1). Champions/Hero System. I just seem to bounce off it, I read the mechanics and my eyes glaze over and have done so
since the systems were new. :/Layout? Too many numbers tied into layout? Not sure, I just know that reading the books
always is tedious and playing the game feet the same way.

2). Fudge/Fate and actually narrative focused rpgs. These systems feel like they don't want the structure/mechanics in place
to keep the ship afloat. Instead you have vague rules or a lack of rules mechanics to handle things. So you end up with a
lack of consistency that can cause arguments and issues. Why would you want to gut the superstructure and leave the paint?
I just don't get it.

Do I want a clunky game mechanics system or one that's so heavy that it slows down game play? Nope, sure don't. I want an
elegant consistent system that allows me to learn it and then it's always just there when I need it. Narrative should always be a
part of playing a tabletop rpg, that many focus on that to the exclusion of solid game mechanics baffles me. Or that because a game
system might be more crunchy that it can't be narrative boggles me too. So games like Fate to me are like selling me a car with a
beautiful paint job, great interior but no fucking engine. WTF.

3). Genesis systems by Fantasy Flight Games. Those fucking dice. Look, let me explain it to you like this. As I mentioned above in the
narrative game issue, I like to learn something and then once I do focus on playing or running the game. Clear so far? Well the fucking
problem with Genesis mechanics system is its like living in a foreign country where you're having to parse the language that isn't your
native language all the time.

Some people have a knack for it (The language test the government/military has is a decent test, I did ok as an aside when I took it),
others do not. That said regardless I spent almost a decade in Germany and even though English and Deutch share many similarities
I was always translating in my head everything I said or read. There was always a lag mentally basically. I feel the same way about
Fantasy Flight Games Genesis dice.

If I have to spend time deciphering the damn dice every time they're rolled before I can go on with telling the players what's going on,
then your system sucks ass. I don't want to decipher the damn dice before I know what's happening in other words in my rpg game.
It's an impedance, don't add to slowing down game play with unnecessary crap like specialty dice. Oh and then there is the whole
"I need specialty dice" issue, where to find them and to hope that they're always around. Fantasy Flight Games has proven to be
a flighty, mercurial game company, having to depend on them to make their funky dice available is another nail in that coffin.


Ok, I feel better now, got that off of my chest. I recognize for some these are great systems but for me they aren't. Though Hero System I actually feel bad about because I feel that it's just me. I feel my issues with number two and three have more substance and merit. (shrugs) If you love these systems, that's fine. I actually own bits of all three because game systems fascinate me. I don't hold it against you. It's my issue not yours in other words.
 
robertsconley said:
Yes I am aware. And I was talking about the Green Ronin RPG.
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Ok, so does that mean you're aware that with the gritty mechanics settings that hit point bloat isn't an issue? I mean I personally have issues with AGE myself and Green Ronin in particular though I'm fond of its people. I just don't see hit point bloat as being an issue with that system.
 
TristramEvans said:
What does Vegemite actually taste like?
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My dad starting eating Vegemite after going to Australia and he use to put it in our soup. I don't remember ever eating it plain on a sandwich (though I am sure I must have tried once or twice), but in a soup, like someone mentioned, its quite salty. I liked it a lot that way (added more to the broth).
 
BedrockBrendan said:
My dad starting eating Vegemite after going to Australia and he use to put it in our soup. I don't remember ever eating it plain on a sandwich (though I am sure I must have tried once or twice), but in a soup, like someone mentioned, its quite salty. I liked it a lot that way (added more to the broth).
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It's not bad as a flavour enhancer in mince as well.
 
Nobby-W said:
I've not tried Natto, although it's on my hit list if I ever get back to Japan.
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About ten years ago, I was staying with some friends in Japan. My first morning there, Mayuko was making breakfast for the kids, and she offered me a bowl of natto. It was horrible in every way. The look, taste and texture were all completely unappealing to me. Still, I pride myself on my ability acquire a taste for things, so I pushed through and ate it all.

The next day, she gave me another larger bowl. I didn't want to be defeated, so while it wasn't easy, I ate it all. I was not getting any closer to developing an appreciation for it.

The day after that, there was yet another bowl of natto. I took a couple of bites and stopped. "Mayuko, I hate to say it, but I don't really like natto."

She replied, "Oh, I know! I just wanted to see how long it would take you to admit it."
 
Acmegamer said:
Ok, so does that mean you're aware that with the gritty mechanics settings that hit point bloat isn't an issue? I mean I personally have issues with AGE myself and Green Ronin in particular though I'm fond of its people. I just don't see hit point bloat as being an issue with that system.
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It was until the release of Modern AGE and it's options. It still the default with Fantasy AGE but the system is pretty straightforward to modify. So after the first two campaigns we modified it to tone it down. This well before the release of Modern AGE.
 
Baulderstone said:
About ten years ago, I was staying with some friends in Japan. My first morning there, Mayuko was making breakfast for the kids, and she offered me a bowl of natto. It was horrible in every way. The look, taste and texture were all completely unappealing to me. Still, I pride myself on my ability acquire a taste for things, so I pushed through and ate it all.

The next day, she gave me another larger bowl. I didn't want to be defeated, so while it wasn't easy, I ate it all. I was not getting any closer to developing an appreciation for it.

The day after that, there was yet another bowl of natto. I took a couple of bites and stopped. "Mayuko, I hate to say it, but I don't really like natto."

She replied, "Oh, I know! I just wanted to see how long it would take you to admit it."
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I had a similar experience with durian the first time I tried it in Indonesia. The in-laws kept feeding me it until I said I didn't really like it.
 
Endless Flight said:
Here’s a thread where you might shock some Pub members to the core. What’s a critically and/or commercially successful RPG that you don’t like or even possibly loathe and for what reason?
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D&D takes the crown for me.
Why? Several reasons...
1. Hit Points. It's a mechanic that only makes sense to me with narrative logic. And even then it simply doesn't produce the results I want.
2. Classes.
3. Levels.
4. "Fire and forget" spells.
5. Dungeons. It's not that I hate dungeons so much, it's the fact you can't get some people's minds out of the dungeon.
 
OK, well this proved controversial when it was pointed out on another site, but the winner of the Origins Award last year went to.....Teens in Space.

I haven’t played it, and can’t therefore criticize it too heavily, but considering that it is a direct adaptation of another game - Kids on Bikes - utilizing the same system and essentially just transplanting it into a different background, how innovative can it actually be?

Following on, a whole bunch of ‘indie’ games out there currently are just straight adaptations of other games - notably, PBTA, Gumshoe, Fate and so on - all of which were created over a decade ago now. I mean, how independent can they be?

I’m not necessarily knocking people who like them or the games themselves necessarily - but in terms of innovation, it’s hardly any different to D20/OGL.
 
Trippy said:
OK, well this proved controversial when it was pointed out on another site, but the winner of the Origins Award last year went to.....Teens in Space.

I haven’t played it, and can’t therefore criticize it too heavily, but considering that it is a direct adaptation of another game - Kids on Bikes - utilizing the same system and essentially just transplanting it into a different background, how innovative can it actually be?

Following on, a whole bunch of ‘indie’ games out there currently are just straight adaptations of other games - notably, PBTA, Gumshoe, Fate and so on - all of which were created over a decade ago now. I mean, how independent can they be?

I’m not necessarily knocking people who like them or the games themselves necessarily - but in terms of innovation, it’s hardly any different to D20/OGL.
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The invocation is having a trend of RPGs aimed at children!!!! That's never happened before!
 
Trippy said:
OK, well this proved controversial when it was pointed out on another site, but the winner of the Origins Award last year went to.....Teens in Space.
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What was it's competition? What was the particular award?

I own the core book. Miniature Market was effectively giving them away a long time back and I tossed a copy into my order because I only needed a couple of bucks until free shipping.

It's OK as things of its nature go. I wouldn't call anything about it exceptional whether that be rules or presentation or writing. It's comparable to hundreds of other games you could find on DTRPG.
 
Gabriel said:
What was it's competition? What was the particular award?
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It won the 2020 Origins Award for best RPG.

I think the other nominees were a collection of PBTA and Gumshoe games, for the most part.
 
Trippy said:
It won the 2020 Origins Award for best RPG.

I think the other nominees were a collection of PBTA and Gumshoe games, for the most part.
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OK, I looked it up. It's competition was:

Alien
Cyberpunk Red
Overlight: The Ivory Masoleum
Over the Edge 3e
Pathfinder Core 2e
Star Crossed
The Expanse

I own Alien and Cyberpunk Red. I'm honestly not terribly impressed with Cyberpunk Red, but Alien strikes me as a standout.

I haven't seen any of the others, but I'm going to make a very subjective statement here.

I call shenanigans.
 
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