What's the best Western RPG?

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Shooting Iron arrived today and I have thumbed through it. It is based on the OGL, it is class and level based, ascending AC, lots of special abilities for each class, and a skill system that you roll against a GM set DC. If that is what you want it looks like a decent version of that. I personally don't like class and level for more modern games so I probably won't get it to the table. There is a ton of background material in the book if you don't already have that covered. If someone was used to D20 games and only had a passing knowledge of westerns this looks like it would be a good game to go with.

Here is a review from Amazon that goes into more depth, it was posted by a reviewer named Brent Wolke

"Shooting Iron is the dark horse of Western RPGs. It's very likely you never heard of it, or seen it. I've only ever found it for sale on Amazon. What it lacks in fancy layout or overproduced art it makes up for it by packing in a walloping solid 244 pages of tight, lean, gaming material with a veritable treasure trove of extras to cover darn near anything you'd need to know or have a rule to cover. By the author's own admission, there are still elements missing - such as greater depth on Indians - and hoped to cover those elements in future books (though 3 years on, that looks like it isn't happening).

All that being said, it's not a rule's heavy system at all. In fact, chances are, you already know it quite well. Shooting Iron is built on the 3rd Edition Dungeons & Dragons OGL, with abundant streamlining and revised focus' on a straight, non-weird, old west. There are many Old West games built on the d20 system. This is the superior product.

There are the usual 6 attributes, and 8 tailored-to-the-old-west classess such as Cowboy and Gambler - must haves - but also less obvious classes like Pioneer and Townie. There is also an elegant skill system that has a light touch on the rules, but with vast implications to a character's knowledge and abilities.

The equipment section leaves you wanting nothing else to name. It's chock full of weapons and gear and everyday items, and I appreciate the rarity codes which handles whether Item A is likely to be found at an isolated fort (for example) for sale.

The combat section is less convoluted than the 3rd edition game it's based on, and takes nought but 2 dozen or so pages to cover and that includes optional rules.

There is a section on critters (and their stats) but an amazing thing is the section on horses with loads of random tables to determine an individual horse almost as if it was a separate character - complete with levels and abilities! A really nice touch!

The next 100 or so pages is all random tables for everything from the kind of encounters you might stumble across in the Alaskan wilderness, to the kinds of rolling stock attached to a train, to the chances a judge might be corrupt, to the make up of a cavalry unit. None of it is required for game play, but it stands ready to fill in blanks the moment a GM needs details he or she hadn't planned on. My absolute favorite part is - what is essentially - a hex crawling system to wander the wilds and see what you might encounter.

I will put this part in bold if I could: Even if you have no interest in the game itself, the last 100 pages are worth the price to get access to all the research the author has condensed into useful bits that can be used in any game.

The Nitty Gritty
Total Page Count: 244 Pages
Character Creation: 35 Pages
Game Mechanics: 21 Pages
Everything Else: 188 Pages

Judgement: I cannot recommend this one enough. It sits atop all other Western RPGs I own as my go-to game.

BONUS!: The fine people over at BoxToad Creations, using the OGL, created a beautifully produced adventure called The Quicksilver Express for Shooting Iron. It is a work of art. It clocks in between 32 to 62 pages depending on how you print it. It's free, and therefore a must have to go with Shooting Iron."
Thanks for checking it out. Like you, I don't know that the system will work for me and my group. I may pick it up at some point just for the reference material.


Thanks!
 
Having played a good number of western games, I have to say Western Hero (choose your favorite edition I would go with Hero 4th (which is second) ed western hero). It gives you all the things you want to do in a western game without any klunky bolt on mechanics. You can go chronicles from dirty and realistic to near pulp heroes. You can do your western in the Old West, but move it to Victorian England, Canada, or other places, with little work.

Plus you have the option to add other weirdness... kung fu, dinosaurs, superpowers, subterranean cultures (there is an actual serial that did this), aliens (cowboys vs aliens), or monsters (there have been westerns with vampires, were, and aztec mummies)... through hero system. I have to admit, I like westerns plus weird.

I have to state that "human level games" are the sweet spot for Hero system... and avoids any of the complaints people have about the system. As long as you have human level stats, speeds under five, and no open powers (things players build, not bought "as is" from a list), there is not "complicated math" or serious crunch. (Biggest hero system complaints.) It is just adding roughly 10 numbers twice at this point. And people see the core rule books, but don't realize that only 70 pages of the 400 pages are used for character creation.
 
Western Hero is one of the ones I don't have, sounds like 4E is the one to track down.
 
It's not the best western, but mine is being released to Gauntlet publishing's Patreon members this summer, then Drivethru this fall. It's called Ghosts of El Paso and it is a re-skin of the Between. The only supernatural elements are ghosts. It's based in historical El Paso around 1880 right before it becomes a boomtown. The town is being afflicted by a reoccurring "Blood Moon" curse and players are members of the vigilance committee who are trying sort out the hauntings and figure out the cause of the curse.

I had a blast with three different playtest groups and it has changed quite a bit from when I first started. In a nut shell, it just became darker and the player characters picked up more supernatural aspects (like cursed revolvers).

If you're interested, I go through the process, characters, and threats over in the Design & Development thread.
 
It's not the best western, but mine is being released to Gauntlet publishing's Patreon members this summer, then Drivethru this fall. It's called Ghosts of El Paso and it is a re-skin of the Between. The only supernatural elements are ghosts. It's based in historical El Paso around 1880 right before it becomes a boomtown. The town is being afflicted by a reoccurring "Blood Moon" curse and players are members of the vigilance committee who are trying sort out the hauntings and figure out the cause of the curse.

I had a blast with three different playtest groups and it has changed quite a bit from when I first started. In a nut shell, it just became darker and the player characters picked up more supernatural aspects (like cursed revolvers).

If you're interested, I go through the process, characters, and threats over in the Design & Development thread.
Okay! Consider me very interested in this one. :smile:

And I love the Between too!
 
Okay! Consider me very interested in this one. :smile:

And I love the Between too!
When it comes out, I'll definitely post links.

My favorite part of the playtesting is how everyone really leaned into the characters. Some of them had 3 different players and they all took different approaches to them.
 
Just grabbed it, that was one I didn’t have. Now I need to get the print version from Lulu.
 
Just grabbed it, that was one I didn’t have. Now I need to get the print version from Lulu.
Awesome! Thank you very much!
No problem!

My own spooky western may end up on drive thru at some point. Currently it's for patreon supporters of Gauntlet publishing.
View attachment 49586

It uses the PbtA mechanics from the Between.
That looks cool! Let me know when you get it posted.
 
Okay, I have played about a dozen or so western games (including GURPs to run a western game). In my opinion, Western Hero (1st or 2nd ed, which is Hero 3rd and 4th) was the easiest to set up and actually play in. It has rules for all sorts of things, including horses. The "normal range" of Hero is a sweet spot. Character generation is simply adding two (and half) columns of numbers (stats and skills/perks - to a maximum of disads plus base). Combat, as long as nobody has a speed of greater than five, is a breeze. (Especially if you roll against 11+OCV, with the difference of the roll being the DCV you hit). The damage is more cinematic, with stun and wounds.

You could run range games. You could run town games. You could run Ponderosa styled games. You could go to the big eastern cities (or western). You could go and run a mountain man game. My troupe was not overly fond of the genre, but we would run "a movie" once and a while. It worked really well for us.


Plus, a bonus for me because I can never leave well enough alone, is that I can use Hero to build in any "oddness" I want. I can have dinosaurs. I can have underground Atlanteans. I can have aliens. I can have zombies, demons, vampires, et all. I can build Steampunk (Curse you Lovelace!). It made my gaming easier.
 
So, I just went and ordered Haunted West in print and pdf...
 
What I consider to easily be the most authentic western rpg is Åskfågeln's Western IV. Although the backers of the crowdfunded project have the full game in pdf, it has yet to be released publicly, and with the death of an author/publisher, its timeline is still unknown.

The game offers three modes of play, depending on the realism each group may want: realism, campaign, and cinematic action.

A phenomenal setting and system that suffers only from not being released.
 
What I consider to easily be the most authentic western rpg is Åskfågeln's Western IV. Although the backers of the crowdfunded project have the full game in pdf, it has yet to be released publicly, and with the death of an author/publisher, its timeline is still unknown.

The game offers three modes of play, depending on the realism each group may want: realism, campaign, and cinematic action.

A phenomenal setting and system that suffers only from not being released.
I backed that Kickstarter and went all-in.

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What I consider to easily be the most authentic western rpg is Åskfågeln's Western IV. Although the backers of the crowdfunded project have the full game in pdf, it has yet to be released publicly, and with the death of an author/publisher, its timeline is still unknown.

The game offers three modes of play, depending on the realism each group may want: realism, campaign, and cinematic action.

A phenomenal setting and system that suffers only from not being released.
They are finally shipping the Freeway Warrior books, I backed the option that waited to ship them all at once, so they are slowly moving forward.
 
I've heard good things about Print the Legend, which seems to be at least inspired by Boot Hill 3e. I've long wanted a straight western rpg that isn't overly crunchy. I've considered picking up Boot Hill 2 and 3e, but haven't yet, as I'm holding out for something newer, at least for now.
 
I've heard good things about Print the Legend, which seems to be at least inspired by Boot Hill 3e. I've long wanted a straight western rpg that isn't overly crunchy. I've considered picking up Boot Hill 2 and 3e, but haven't yet, as I'm holding out for something newer, at least for now.
So Boot Hill 2E is still my favorite western rpg but you have to be ok with a game that is basically just combat mechanics. I’m fine just role playing all the social and other stuff but if you want mechanical support for activities outside combat (and gambling) you probably don’t want Boot Hill 2E except for historical purposes. Boot Hill 3E does have a decent skill system and looks like a pretty good game but I have never played it.
 
I've heard good things about Print the Legend, which seems to be at least inspired by Boot Hill 3e. I've long wanted a straight western rpg that isn't overly crunchy. I've considered picking up Boot Hill 2 and 3e, but haven't yet, as I'm holding out for something newer, at least for now.
I own Print the Legend. It looks pretty good but something about the rules causes my eyes to glaze over. I'm sure it's just me and anyobdy else will be able to make perfect sense of it. I did put it up for sale/trade.
 
I backed that Kickstarter and went all-in.
We did as well. And have not been the least bit disappointed in the product.

The husband and Tove had numerous communications about the game some years back. He had first encountered it when some Swedes were playing it in the backcountry of Yellowstone circa 1992. The group of Swedes (and one Norwegian) were on a camping tour of the Old West where they ran game session in some rather curious locations. :grin:
 
Print the Legend definitely takes a ton of inspiration from Boot Hill, particularly 3e. It also adds a brief advantages and disadvantages system, nothing too crunchy or difficult, and an interesting career system where you set goals for your character like opening a business or buying land or becoming a wealthy cattle baron. As you complete milestones along the way to your ultimate goal, your Renown increases and your resources expand. On the surface, the system is a pretty simple percentile system, with 6 attributes plus Luck, and skills. There are a BUNCH of skills, but characters only start with either 6, 8 or 10 of them, depending on the total of their attributes. Any skill or attribute check in the game is a simple percentile roll, with equal or under the relevant ability being success. Modifiers can of course be applied. Combat uses a "count" system where different types of shots take differing amounts of time to fire. The round is six seconds long, divided into 6 1-second counts. A careful shot is an aimed shot takes place on count 6 in the round, a steady shot which is just leveling the gun and firing happens on count 3 and 6 with some sacrificed accuracy, a hip shot with further reduced accuracy takes place on count 2, 4 and 6 and fan-firing happens on each of counts 1 through 6 but at severely reduced accuracy. There are a few other bells and whistles but that is the main thrust of the system. Combat can be pretty deadly, which I like in a western game, but does have a Luck check that happens when mortally wounded so provides a chance to escape death. This is very similar to Boot Hill 3e.

At one time five or six years ago, I was running the game for my local group and was in communication with the author to get a few rules questions answered. He actually released a single adventure for the game, Agua Sangrienta, which can be found at drivethrurpg here. I believe he had plans for more stuff for the game but nothing has been released since that adventure in 2017.

I would never claim it's the best, but I did release Smoke Wagon today

What can you tell us about your game? What's the system like?
 
Combat uses a "count" system where different types of shots take differing amounts of time to fire. The round is six seconds long, divided into 6 1-second counts. A careful shot is an aimed shot takes place on count 6 in the round, a steady shot which is just leveling the gun and firing happens on count 3 and 6 with some sacrificed accuracy, a hip shot with further reduced accuracy takes place on count 2, 4 and 6 and fan-firing happens on each of counts 1 through 6 but at severely reduced accuracy. There are a few other bells and whistles but that is the main thrust of the system.
Yeah... that's what I meant.
 
What can you tell us about your game? What's the system like?
I missed seeing this, but good old ORtrail ORtrail pointed it out to me.

Smoke Wagon uses a system known as Breathless, which is a rules light and somewhat narrative rpg. It was originally designed for a zombie horror game, but once the SRD was released, people have used it for all kinds of games. The main mechanic for checks involves rolling your skill, which can range from D12 to D4. Like some other games, the roll is more than just succeed or fail; you can succeed with a cost. Skills start at D4, and you can assign 1D10, 1D8 and 1D6 to three of those, replacing the D4 as the rating.

As things progress, the skill dice goes down unless you "catch your breath", which is a narrative pause in action that allows you to reset your skill back to it's normal die rating.

There's no stats, and instead of hit points, you have a stress track (in Smoke Wagon, it's called Spooked) that accounts for any stress you take (physical damage, mental trauma, etc), but in one track. You can heal that by laying low to rest, or using a med kit (in Smoke Wagon, it's called Snake Oil).

Stuff like Snake Oil and other useful items are kept in your War Bag (another name for a saddlebag). These items do have die ratings like skills. When they get used up, they go away until it makes sense for it to be used again in the fiction (so a little like the PbtA style games in that sense). You get to also do Loot Checks, which can get you new items or replace Snake Oil in your War Bag.

Smoke Wagon, like other games, uses a form of class. In the SRD, they're called Kits; in Smoke Wagon, they're professions. Each Professions gives a player a unique skill they can use on top of all the other skills. These always start at D10. I had one Profession (the general one for Cowboys) not have one, but instead have 3 skills at D8 (on top of one at D10 and one at D6) to showcase them being more of a Jack of all Trades type.

The mechanics themselves take up all of 2 pages, and the Character Creation 3 more, and that is because I featured 10 professions, along with art for all but one of them.

I like it as it's a simple game at it's core, but could easily be hacked to add more depth. Various other publishers have added mechanical bits to it (some of which I've used with the other two games I've written using the system), and I added something with another game I'm in the middle of writing. It won't appeal to everyone obviously, but I like using it to make some rpgs with.
 
urbwar urbwar - I bought the game to check it out. Pretty straightforward, rules-lite game, but a couple of questions popped up as I read.

First, what is a point of By Hook or By Crook? It is referenced in the "Checks" portion of the rules and mentions seeing page 6 but I see no other references to it in the book.

Second, since the game is narrative and everything happens from the skill checks, no list of weapons or equipment is needed. If you attack, you simply either succeed, succeed with cost or fail, and the specific weapon used has little bearing other than narratively. Am I correct here? Basically you can say your character has a Colt Peacemaker or a Winchester 73 and they both do the same thing rules-wise?

Third, as a wild west game, there are certainly going to be gunfights. If a character shoots another, what happens to them? If the shot is successful, does the person who gets shot take 1 point of spooked? And if the shot is successful with cost, do both characters take 1 spooked and on a failure the shooter takes 1 spooked, or on a failure the skill just decreases as normal?
 
urbwar urbwar - I bought the game to check it out. Pretty straightforward, rules-lite game, but a couple of questions popped up as I read.

First, what is a point of By Hook or By Crook? It is referenced in the "Checks" portion of the rules and mentions seeing page 6 but I see no other references to it in the book.

Second, since the game is narrative and everything happens from the skill checks, no list of weapons or equipment is needed. If you attack, you simply either succeed, succeed with cost or fail, and the specific weapon used has little bearing other than narratively. Am I correct here? Basically you can say your character has a Colt Peacemaker or a Winchester 73 and they both do the same thing rules-wise?

Third, as a wild west game, there are certainly going to be gunfights. If a character shoots another, what happens to them? If the shot is successful, does the person who gets shot take 1 point of spooked? And if the shot is successful with cost, do both characters take 1 spooked and on a failure the shooter takes 1 spooked, or on a failure the skill just decreases as normal?
Thanks for the questions!

1) So it seems I uploaded a copy that left out the part on By Hook or By Crook. That's basically survivor points gasp in the SRD. I'm not sure how that got removed from the file, but I will fix that when I get a chance (probably tomorrow). Color me embarrassed, and I apologize. I should have caught that.

To give you a rundown on that: Whenever you take a point of Spooked, you get 1 point of By Hook or By Crook. You can accumulate them as much as you like. They can be spent both before and during the session.

Before the session, you can spend 1 point of BHoBC to regain 2 Spooked, increase a skill by 1 die step (up to D10; to go past D10 costs 2 points of BHoBC), or spend 1 to increase an item by 1 step. Normally skills go do D12, but I'm checking with the author of that rule to see if they kept it to that limit or not. There is another gasp that has you roll a D20, so if you want them to by really competent, letting them go up to a D20 would be a good high end.

During the session, you can spend 1 point to regain 1 Spooked, Spend 1 point to avoid a consequence (if a roll or action would incur one), or spend 1 to fully recharge a skill without a consequence.

2) Yes, the specific weapon isn't relevant due to how checks are. Opposition (ie NPC's) will normally go down if you get one success; in some games, you it can require multiple ones (for instance, in Hunter$, Vampires require multiple successes to take down. How many depends on the type of Vampire). So if you want the characters to face a more dangerous opponent, it could take multiple successes to take them down. So if a bad guy requires 3 successes to defeat, and he's fighting 3 characters, and each one scores a success on them, they go down.

3) It would depend on what would fit the situation best. If it comes with a cost, you could have the shooter take a point of spooked, or maybe the other person fired back and your horse reared, knocking you off it, or you gun jams. It doesn't always have to be taking spooked for either option; it depends on the situation (or fiction, however you want to frame it). Given you only have 4 dots in Spooked, if you took it every time, characters would go down more often.

Regardless of success or failure, the skill would decrease, because you rolled for it.

I hope that answers your questions. Let me know if you have more!
 
I'm a big old west genre fan and own a lot of the games listed herein. My faves are Sidewinder: Recoiled, Wild West Cinema, and Shotguns & Saddles.

I'm a player in a new Sidewinder: Recoiled campaign starting tomorrow over Roll20.
 
I'm a big old west genre fan and own a lot of the games listed herein. My faves are Sidewinder: Recoiled, Wild West Cinema, and Shotguns & Saddles.

I'm a player in a new Sidewinder: Recoiled campaign starting tomorrow over Roll20.
Is that the one that requires full poker hand use of cards?
 
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