You're not a Grognard, but...

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Simlasa

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IME PC monster races were always welcome if they fit the setting/campaign. Runequest and Arduin Grimoire both seemed to welcome them with open arms.
Playing a Hiver in Traveller was really trippy...

That said, there is a sort of Player who ALWAYS wants to be some little trickster creature... and uses that to be disruptive and annoying, starting fights with every NPC they meet. There's one in our current 5e game, but our GM is happy to dole out the consequences for that behavior.
 

spittingimage

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Heck, a lizard man is part of the party of adventurers in the very first D&D (and first Greyhawk) novel.

View attachment 41139
The look on that dragon's face is "I can't believe you woke me from a thousand-year sleep for this bullshit."

That said, there is a sort of Player who ALWAYS wants to be some little trickster creature... and uses that to be disruptive and annoying, starting fights with every NPC they meet. There's one in our current 5e game, but our GM is happy to dole out the consequences for that behavior.
I want this to be me in my group's next game. It's Pathfinder 1E and I'm already buttering the GM up to let me play a pyromaniac goblin alchemist. The other PCs'll have to keep me on a friggin' leash.
 

Godfather Punk

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After 30+ years, I'm a bit fed up with halfling rogues, elf MU's , half-elf rangers, dwarf fighters, ... so yeah! I tend to wanna play Dragonborn Warlords, Goblin Skalds, Ghenasi Swordmage... because the rest is so been-there-done-that-got-the-t-shirt a hundred times...

Definitely not a Grognard
 
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Black Leaf

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That said, there is a sort of Player who ALWAYS wants to be some little trickster creature... and uses that to be disruptive and annoying, starting fights with every NPC they meet. There's one in our current 5e game, but our GM is happy to dole out the consequences for that behavior.
Then they hit university age and discovered fucking Malkavians.
 

Nobby-W

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After 30+ years, I'm a bit fed up with halfling rogues, elf MU's , half-elf rangers, dwarf fighters, ... so yeah! I tend to wanna play Dragonborn Warlords, Goblin Skalds, Ghenasi Swordmage... because the rest is so been-there-done-that-got-the-t-shirt a hundred times...
I did a hobbit barbarian the other day. Based on McBlane from the Fall and Rise of Reginald Perrin,

 

arjunstc

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Hasn't elves being racist been a standard trope for decades now? (When elves are used in fantasy at all - which is increasingly rare these days).

OK, I am risking a ban to make this joke, but...

Racist elves were invented by white people because if other people wanted a race that thought they were better at everything than anyone else, they'd just use white people. :angel:
 

CRKrueger

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OK, I am risking a ban to make this joke, but...

Racist elves were invented by white people because if other people wanted a race that thought they were better at everything than anyone else, they'd just use white people. :angel:
Now that's funny, but elves were really invented by the British for the same reason.
 

arjunstc

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Beyond that, as is the nature of such things, Rolek the Orc isn't in any danger from me, who lives the next street over, kitty-cornered. Rolek's a thatcher, worships at St. Taria's on Waterday like the rest of us, his family's been in the neighborhood for years. Quiet enough if he doesn't get too plastered at the local tavern, does a good workmanlike job, his word's good. Rolek's okay. He's a good orc, doncha know.

But across town in the Firewalker's District, or in Port Norfolk, or up past East Gate Square, they don't know him, and when the riot starts, he'd better not be in that part of town. And sure, we'll tell Rolek to get off the street and stay quiet, we'll just stand watch in front of his house, but his cousin Kuglek from across the Grand Canal better not be seen walking OUR streets, damn filthy orc scum.

To steal from I can't recall whether it was Prachett or Rankin...

I once asked my father about orcs and he told me: "Son, as with humans, there are good orcs and bad orcs." I thanked him and walked away, and when he thought I was out of earshot he said: "I just don't understand why all the bad ones have to live on my street..."
 

Shipyard Locked

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After 30+ years, I'm a bit fed up with halfling rogues, elf MU's , half-elf rangers, dwarf fighters, ... so yeah! I tend to wanna play Dragonborn Warlords, Goblin Skalds, Ghenasi Swordmage... because the rest is so been-there-done-that-got-the-t-shirt a hundred times...

This is always an interesting statement to me, one I've heard a few times in various forms. I tend to ask: Do you also get tired of normal earth humans, from normal earth countries, with exciting professions going on dangerous adventures?
 

Godfather Punk

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If by 'normal' you mean people that look like me and come from a similar background/country, then also yes, I like to occasionally change my spies, my archeologist, my occultists from 'normal' to somebody from outside my experience zone (different nationality, culture, politics or religion).
When playing SciFi or other offworld adventures, I don't mind playing an alien species, and when playing Toon I sometimes am the animated toaster.
 

Shipyard Locked

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If by 'normal' you mean people that look like me and come from a similar background/country, then also yes, I like to occasionally change my spies, my archeologist, my occultists from 'normal' to somebody from outside my experience zone (different nationality, culture, politics or religion).
When playing SciFi or other offworld adventures, I don't mind playing an alien species, and when playing Toon I sometimes am the animated toaster.

Are there some nationalities/cultures other than your own that you are sick of using as well?

This isn't a gotcha by the way, I sympathize to some extent because to me the standard array of elf/dwarf/halfling usually ends up playing like different nationalities rather than species anyway. I've been at very few tables where those three races felt alien enough to justify using them over fictional human nationalities.

I ask these sorts of questions because I'm honestly a little nervous about personally getting so jaded that normal human dramas and adventures aren't good enough for me anymore.
 

Black Leaf

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Are there some nationalities/cultures other than your own that you are sick of using as well?

This isn't a gotcha by the way, I sympathize to some extent because to me the standard array of elf/dwarf/halfling usually ends up playing like different nationalities rather than species anyway. I've been at very few tables where those three races felt alien enough to justify using them over fictional human nationalities.

I ask these sorts of questions because I'm honestly a little nervous about personally getting so jaded that normal human dramas and adventures aren't good enough for me anymore.
I'm pretty bored of standard medieval (knights, castles etc.) unless it's done very well indeed.
 

David Johansen

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I've probably mentioned him before but my halfling barbarian is Starkers the Enormous who paints himself blue and drops his tartan before battle so he can be invulnerable. Stacking constitution and dexterity bonus on armor class in fifth edition makes halflings very effective barbarians. :grin: His name was inspired by Volstagg the Enormous from Marvel's Thor comics. Who at one point, after his clothing was burned away by an energy blast, declared, "and now you see why I am called Volstagg the Enormous!"
 

Godfather Punk

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Are there some nationalities/cultures other than your own that you are sick of using as well?
Well, to be fair, our games on Earth-1 are quite rare; it's mostly Fantasy or SciFi. And I am usually the GM in our 007 or Cthulhu games so the problem hasn't really come up, but as most settings are either UK or US-centered I do like to play characters from other nations, even my own for once.

But, grognard thread oblige, in D&D Eberron is a setting that allows for more exotic races so I will go for a Kech Volaar goblin or an Orc Druid, and when I pick something out of the ordinary in Faerun, I pick a race that has at least some connection to the setting. I will read up on the old civilisations of the Dragonborn in Toril and Abeir, and mould my character to someone who has a reason to be in the party, and not just another freak in the traveling circus.

What annoys me more is the player who will play the same character (human/elf/dwarf) in every game, campaign or setting (maybe because it's familiar to them) so I go for some counterbalance :smile:
 
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Shipyard Locked

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I'm pretty bored of standard medieval (knights, castles etc.) unless it's done very well indeed.

I believe you, but it's hard (uncomfortable?) for me to imagine feeling that way, especially if we're talking about authentic medieval rather than theme-park-mega-mall fantasy medieval. The way I see it, even a dedicated medieval aficionado is forced to mentally exist in our modern world for at least 75% of his life. Can one really get bored of imaginary adventures in standard medieval when there's so little time to actually spend in it compared to the cozy drudgery of real life? We're not talking about the repetitive limits of a video game here, we're talking about ten thousand possible stories in a setting very different from our own.

What annoys me more is the player who will play the same character (human/elf/dwarf) in every game, campaign or setting (maybe because it's familiar to them) so I go for some counterbalance :smile:

Ah, guilty as charged.:sweat:
While I did play a crocodile man recently, I mostly play myself when I'm not a GM. I guess I'm more interested in in the tools at my disposal and the choices I'm faced with than fleshing out a semi-independent fictional character.
 

Fenris-77

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I don't find I'm tired of Medieval stuff because so few RPGs are actually authentically Medieval in any way. D&D never really was and certainly isn't now. Games like Harn manage it, as do some others, but they aren't games I ever played much.

I have a Medieval history background, so my expectations about what is 'medieval' or not might be different than some other peoples'.
 

Black Leaf

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I believe you, but it's hard (uncomfortable?) for me to imagine feeling that way, especially if we're talking about authentic medieval rather than theme-park-mega-mall fantasy medieval. The way I see it, even a dedicated medieval aficionado is forced to mentally exist in our modern world for at least 75% of his life. Can one really get bored of imaginary adventures in standard medieval when there's so little time to actually spend in it compared to the cozy drudgery of real life? We're not talking about the repetitive limits of a video game here, we're talking about ten thousand possible stories in a setting very different from our own.
I do like authentic medieval, but in my experience there's only a handful of games that actually qualify as such. I'm also fine with something like Pendragon which does things differently. It's really "high fantasy tropes dressed up as medievalism" that I've lost interest in.
 

Ben Adams

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Again I feel I’m from the mirror universe, as I’ve only had one experience with a Storyteller insisting on a backstory, and he used that to get my character into a no-win situation.
If I was in a Vampire game I get it. But that's the storyteller system.
For me D&D is some combat, some environment reaction, and exploration. That's where I grog-hard.
IF I ever get to DM d&d in the near future I want to steal the concept from Warriors of the Eternal Sun. Players are hired to help a king defend his castle from a horde of goblinoids and are loosing. The castle is suddenly whisked away to a an unknown land that is very different from where it came from. While the video game did a move from Known World to Hollow World, mine would be from the main land to a) an island far to the north that once held an unknown lost evil empire that fell apart and is infested with monsters while also locked away from direct divine/abyssal intervention or b) another Barsoom like planet.
Either way background 'story' won't help though the secondary skills (blacksmith, noble) can be used as the players interact w/the locals. This may help keep the, "I have Fate/PbtA super powers," out of the campaign.
 

Brock Savage

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This is always an interesting statement to me, one I've heard a few times in various forms. I tend to ask: Do you also get tired of normal earth humans, from normal earth countries, with exciting professions going on dangerous adventures?
Yah bro I don't get this either. I am nowhere close to being bored of roleplaying humans (or human-adjacent like cyborgs and vampires) who find themselves in exciting, extraordinary circumstances.
 

Ravenswing

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It's a shame you and Old Geezer never got to interact with each other.
OG and I did, however, on multiple forums, and my take on what gamers call "medieval" -- my own college minor was in medieval demographics -- likely squares with Fenris-77's. It's nothing of the sort, of course: my tag line is that the standard "medieval" RPG is really Hollywood/Ren Faire done on Renaissance tech with 19th century Age of Sail maritime. OG and I agreed on a lot, over the years, but probably we wouldn't have thrived at the same gaming table.

What did happen to him, by the bye? Simply GAFIAted, I hope?
 

Black Leaf

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OG and I did, however, on multiple forums, and my take on what gamers call "medieval" -- my own college minor was in medieval demographics -- likely squares with Fenris-77's. It's nothing of the sort, of course: my tag line is that the standard "medieval" RPG is really Hollywood/Ren Faire done on Renaissance tech with 19th century Age of Sail maritime. OG and I agreed on a lot, over the years, but probably we wouldn't have thrived at the same gaming table.
Even using the term unqualified is a bit odd. We're talking about approximately ten centuries.
What did happen to him, by the bye? Simply GAFIAted, I hope?

Got sick of forums from what I heard; he's fine and still talks to his friends on FB.
 

Fenris-77

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Medieval? Early medieval to late medieval period is a remarkably broad stretch of time.
Yup. Everything from the Fall of Rome to the Renaissance give or take. Some people will kvetch and argue about exact dates, but those people are shithead academics who should have better things to do. My two cents anyway.
 

Black Leaf

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Yup. Everything from the Fall of Rome to the Renaissance give or take. Some people will kvetch and argue about exact dates, but those people are shithead academics who should have better things to do. My two cents anyway.
Yeah, I mean I'm not a professional historian, merely a hobbyist, but it even bothers me when people talk about the "Victorian era" as if it's one monolithic bloc. It's like treating the 1940s as culturally indistinct from the 1980s.
 

Fenris-77

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Yeah, I mean I'm not a professional historian, merely a hobbyist, but it even bothers me when people talk about the "Victorian era" as if it's one monolithic bloc. It's like treating the 1940s as culturally indistinct from the 1980s.
To be fair, it is probably significantly more homogeneous that the 40's compared to the 80's, but your point very much stands. Nuance is always welcome.
 

The Butcher

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After 30+ years, I'm a bit fed up with halfling rogues, elf MU's , half-elf rangers, dwarf fighters, ... so yeah! I tend to wanna play Dragonborn Warlords, Goblin Skalds, Ghenasi Swordmage... because the rest is so been-there-done-that-got-the-t-shirt a hundred times...

Definitely not a Grognard
I really go back and forth on this, at least as far as D&D5 is concerned. I adore the classics, the doughty and tanky dwarf fighter, the crack shot elf ranger and so on… and humans, lots of humans.

But sometimes you gotta scratch the weird itch. Dragonborn and Githzerai being some of my favorites. Or just slightly odd class/race combos like Dwarf Druid or Goliath Paladin.
 

Voros

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I'm not a grognard but I do think RQ is better than D&D.

I'm not a grognard but don't believe luck points match the way I like to play CoC.

I'm not a grognard but totally don't get watching extensive liveplays (good for checking out new systems though!).
 

EmperorNorton

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I'm not a grognard but totally don't get watching extensive liveplays (good for checking out new systems though!).

Yeah, this is the only reason I'll watch a liveplay. I'll watch like a oneshot one if it is a group that actually uses the rules correctly, as it gives a bit of the context to the rules. Especially if the designer is running it or something.
 

Brock Savage

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I don't think I'm old enough to count as a grognard, but I grew up playing a mishmash of AD&D 1e and 2e, and developed an as-yet-unrequited love (i.e. I haven't actually gotten to play it) for B/X and BECMI.
Welcome to the board! I highly recommend the Old School Essentials treatment of B/X. The Rules Tome is probably my favorite hardcopy MRB simply based on the excellent editing and presentation alone. Their expansion content, Old-School Essentials Advanced Fantasy, brings AD&D content like classes and magic item to B/X without AD&D's weird, fiddly rules.

I have mixed feelings about the Rules Cyclopedia for BECMI. It departs too much from the clear, succinct rule of B/X for my taste. Try making sense out of the rules for charging in the Cyclopedia and you will see what I mean. On the other hand, the rules for charging and splash damage in the OSE Advanced rules match the simple elegance of B/X.
 
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Ravenswing

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Yeah, I mean I'm not a professional historian, merely a hobbyist, but it even bothers me when people talk about the "Victorian era" as if it's one monolithic bloc. It's like treating the 1940s as culturally indistinct from the 1980s.

Fair enough, and I've always agreed with the point -- my sticky is that you just cannot compare 10th century Scotland to 15th century Tuscany -- but I guess I'm just missing the relevance of the observation.
 

carpocratian

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I am old enough and have been playing rpgs long enough to be a grognard, but whether I am or not depends on your definition of the term.

My general "old school" approach to gaming includes:

- I don't do "balance." There are things in the world that characters may be able to fight, things that they would be foolish to fight, and things that that could kill them without trying. Whether they fight those things or not is up to them. As I tell my players, running away is always an option, and is often the best option.

- I'm consistent with my rules, but I don't feel bound by what is written in the rule books. If I change something, I let the players know, and stick to that, but in the end the book is not a "higher authority" than the GM.

- Modern politics and sensibilities have nothing to do with fantasy worlds, and may or may not be present in things like modern horror games.

- Non-human (or demi-human) races in fantasy games are not "stand ins" for real life ethnic groups.

- NPCs in historical games act as people in those time periods would have, albeit with the understanding that there was a lot of variation in people's outlooks, attitudes, and actions, even during fairly repressive periods.

- Consequences for the choices that characters make flow naturally from the internal rules of the world and the logical reactions of the NPCs. If characters run around killing and stealing with abandon, chances are they are going to draw the ire of a lot of people (or other creatures).

- If a character dies, the character dies. The best way to stay alive in dangerous situations is to be careful, like in real life.

- "Story" emerges from play, in retrospect. I don't have "plots" and "storylines" and things of that nature. You can tell the "story" of your character's adventures in the same way that you can tell the "story" of your summer travel adventures back when you were in college.


In a more general sense, I like pictures of naked (or nearly naked) people, male or female. Frazetta is one of my favorite artists. There is nothing wrong with that.
 

AsenRG

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Yah bro I don't get this either. I am nowhere close to being bored of roleplaying humans (or human-adjacent like cyborgs and vampires) who find themselves in exciting, extraordinary circumstances.
:thumbsup:
Sign me up with those that don't get it. Of course, as an way-too-often Referee, I get to impose a ban on non-humans, so it's not that bad:shade:!
 

zanshin

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After 30+ years, I'm a bit fed up with halfling rogues, elf MU's , half-elf rangers, dwarf fighters, ... so yeah! I tend to wanna play Dragonborn Warlords, Goblin Skalds, Ghenasi Swordmage... because the rest is so been-there-done-that-got-the-t-shirt a hundred times...

Definitely not a Grognard
Well Monsters! Monsters! came out in 1976 , so you can be a Grognard if you want to be :smile:
 

Godfather Punk

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Well Monsters! Monsters! came out in 1976 , so you can be a Grognard if you want to be :smile:
I'd love to, but I'm Definitely not a Grognard, because I've never even seen a Basic D&D set in my life.
My first D&D was already Advanced, and that was after I had played other game systems. :goof:
 
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