Ask me anything about Holmes Basic D&D (1977)

[Bunch]

Thanks, just been minimizing social media for a while.

I'm impressed/depressed we rated as social media.

 

[finarvyn]

It bothered me, and I didn’t don’t fully know, the difference between standard rations and iron rations.

Regular rations would be just food wrapped in some sort of paper but iron rations would be food in cans. If the cans got wet, the food would still be fine.

Also, silver vs steel mirror?

Mechanically the two would be the same. We always assumed that a regular steel mirror would be a big, clunky, rectangular thing and that the silver mirror would be a fancy hand thing. The rules never specified.

in OD&D caltrops were also on the list

Caltrops aren't in the OD&D equipment list. They may be in Holmes basic, but they were not in OD&D.

 

[Bunch]

Regular rations would be just food wrapped in some sort of paper but iron rations would be food in cans. If the cans got wet, the food would still be fine.
Mechanically the two would be the same. We always assumed that a regular steel mirror would be a big, clunky, rectangular thing and that the silver mirror would be a fancy hand thing. The rules never specified.
Caltrops aren't in the OD&D equipment list. They may be in Holmes basic, but they were not in OD&D.

I take this differently. Regular rations would be food that would spoil after a week or so. Iron rations are dried food, hard tack bread and dried meat. It's meant to last longer but at a cost of edibility.

Glass/silver vs steel is a durability question. Drop glass and it breaks. Also reflection quality. Glass/silver excellent. Steel accepted.

 

[Zenopus]

The OD&D and Holmes equipment lists had a parenthetical after Iron Rations: "(for dungeon expeditions)" that seemed to imply that regular rations were in some way not suitable for dungeon delving. Presumably spoilage. In my youth I imagined them to be fortified with iron like vitamins. Apparently it is old British terminology.

Caltrops are not found in the OD&D, Holmes or AD&D equipment lists, but do show up several places in the DMG without any furhter explanation: The random traps table in Appendix G: Traps; the list of Encumbrance of Standard Items in Appendix O; and in a pocket of the Robe of Useful Items in Appendix P: Creating a Party on the Spur of the Moment.

 

[Secrets of Blackmoor]

In the American Civil War, soldiers were given the equivalent of Iron rations. It was corn meal and some grease that they would boil into little cakes to carry with them.

Sometimes they'd get standard rations, known as blue beef, which was meat that was right on the edge of being inedible.

If soldiers got lucky, they might raid a shipment of canned lobsters.

That is the 1860's. Imagine the 1200- 1500 period.

 

[Zenopus]

Chris Holmes (son of J. Eric Holmes) is on the latest episode of the Appendix N Book Club podcast discussing Burroughs' Tarzan at the Earth's Core, a cross-over with the Pellucidar series that his father wrote a sequel (Mahars of Pellucidar) to back in the '70s.

Read more and find the link here:
Chris Holmes guests on the Appendix N Book Club

 

[Arminius]

Well, it must be ~40 years since *someone* brought up caltrops in a D&D game. I guess it was his idea. Thanks for setting me straight.

 

[Gentleman Ranker]

Is it possible that the reference in Holmes to pre-rolled attacks

The exact language is: "The Dungeon Master should have all this completely mapped out, hit points and attack die rolls calculated and recorded, so that the game will proceed most rapidly at the exciting moments when the enemy is encountered".

is a reference to the procedure outlined in "Of Skulls and Scrapfaggot Green" in 1978/79 and used in the Gen Con X dungeon competition in IIRC 1976(?). It's early enough to be a tertiary source for Homes. I don't know how widespread the process was but according to Bob Blake in "of skulls..."

Also, there is an example of pre-rolled monster attacks that will be used wherever and whenever a monster appears.
Remember, this was run as a tournament, thus all monsters were to perform the same for each competing team. Turn
to Building #42 . Simon the Moneylender has just been gurked by a band of Ores that somehow got into town. The
first melee attack for Ore #1 is 1/1. This means that the best armor class that attack could hit is.1, and 1
point of damage would be inflicted. Thus, if it fell on a Fighter with armor class 0, it would miss, but on a
Magic User with armor class 7, it would hit. The fourth melee attack for Ore #3 is 9/1. That means that the only
thing he could hit with that attack would be someone without armor or shield. A " 11 means an automatic miss. I
think you can get the idea. If you run out of pre-rolled attacks, simply go back to mr #1 and start over. Remember
to randomly roll what target a monster is striking; don't match the attack to the armor class of a party member.
In other words, these are just as if they were rolled out on the spot. Use them if you wish, or roll your own.

The sample gives Orc 1, 2 , 3 etc round by round lists of what AC they hit for how much damage.
Could Holmes have been familiar with that process from organised play of the period Zenopus? Or could that process of pre-rolling have been more widespread in the early hobby than we usually suppose?

GR

 

[Moonglum]

That is a breath-takingly inefficient way to spend your time preparing an adventure. You don't know in advance which encounters will happen, which will turn into fights or how long they will go on, so you need to prepare some large number of attack 'rolls' to everyone your characters might potentially run across!

 

[Baulderstone]

Is it possible that the reference in Holmes to pre-rolled attacks


is a reference to the procedure outlined in "Of Skulls and Scrapfaggot Green" in 1978/79 and used in the Gen Con X dungeon competition in IIRC 1976(?). It's early enough to be a tertiary source for Homes. I don't know how widespread the process was but according to Bob Blake in "of skulls..."

Also, there is an example of pre-rolled monster attacks that will be used wherever and whenever a monster appears.
Remember, this was run as a tournament, thus all monsters were to perform the same for each competing team. Turn
to Building #42 . Simon the Moneylender has just been gurked by a band of Ores that somehow got into town. The
first melee attack for Ore #1 is 1/1. This means that the best armor class that attack could hit is.1, and 1
point of damage would be inflicted. Thus, if it fell on a Fighter with armor class 0, it would miss, but on a
Magic User with armor class 7, it would hit. The fourth melee attack for Ore #3 is 9/1. That means that the only
thing he could hit with that attack would be someone without armor or shield. A " 11 means an automatic miss. I
think you can get the idea. If you run out of pre-rolled attacks, simply go back to mr #1 and start over. Remember
to randomly roll what target a monster is striking; don't match the attack to the armor class of a party member.
In other words, these are just as if they were rolled out on the spot. Use them if you wish, or roll your own.

The sample gives Orc 1, 2 , 3 etc round by round lists of what AC they hit for how much damage.
Could Holmes have been familiar with that process from organised play of the period Zenopus? Or could that process of pre-rolling have been more widespread in the early hobby than we usually suppose?

GR

Welcome to the Pub, G Gentleman Ranker!

 

[Gentleman Ranker]

Thanks Baulderstone. Always nice to visit a new pub! What real ale do we have on draft?



It does sound inefficient doesn't it Moonglum; but as noted it was a tournament fairness tactic originally. I just wondered if it might have crept into Holmes from there.

GR

 

[finarvyn]

Caltrops are not found in the OD&D, Holmes or AD&D equipment lists...

Yeah, that always felt like an odd oversight. Another item that should have been on equipment lists was the grappling hook. I don't know about Holmes or AD&D, but I was always surprised that OD&D didn't have those.

 

[Zenopus]

I learned about those things via playing D&D, so I didn't miss them in the beginning. The grappling hook, in particular, is a fan favorite piece of equipment. Use it for climbing or in combat - pull a bookshelf over on the evil wizard!

 

[Zenopus]

Is it possible that the reference in Holmes to pre-rolled attacks


is a reference to the procedure outlined in "Of Skulls and Scrapfaggot Green" in 1978/79 and used in the Gen Con X dungeon competition in IIRC 1976(?). It's early enough to be a tertiary source for Homes. I don't know how widespread the process was but according to Bob Blake in "of skulls..."

Also, there is an example of pre-rolled monster attacks that will be used wherever and whenever a monster appears.
Remember, this was run as a tournament, thus all monsters were to perform the same for each competing team. Turn
to Building #42 . Simon the Moneylender has just been gurked by a band of Ores that somehow got into town. The
first melee attack for Ore #1 is 1/1. This means that the best armor class that attack could hit is.1, and 1
point of damage would be inflicted. Thus, if it fell on a Fighter with armor class 0, it would miss, but on a
Magic User with armor class 7, it would hit. The fourth melee attack for Ore #3 is 9/1. That means that the only
thing he could hit with that attack would be someone without armor or shield. A " 11 means an automatic miss. I
think you can get the idea. If you run out of pre-rolled attacks, simply go back to mr #1 and start over. Remember
to randomly roll what target a monster is striking; don't match the attack to the armor class of a party member.
In other words, these are just as if they were rolled out on the spot. Use them if you wish, or roll your own.

The sample gives Orc 1, 2 , 3 etc round by round lists of what AC they hit for how much damage.
Could Holmes have been familiar with that process from organised play of the period Zenopus? Or could that process of pre-rolling have been more widespread in the early hobby than we usually suppose?

Great find!

I was generally aware of the special rules in those Bob Blake JG tournament modules, but not that particular rule. I believe that the first Gen Con that Holmes attended was Gen Con X, but that Gen Con was in 1977, not 1976 - after Holmes Basic had been published. Bob Blake did run another tournament the year before, which was also published by JG under the plainly titled "Gen Con IX Dungeons" (JG055). Taking a look at that, I do see a section on pre-rolled monster attacks! It's not explained in as much detail, but is mentioned:

Another important contributing factor to consistency in DMing was pre-rolled monster attacks . Each monster had 10 rounds of attacks rolled out (using Greyhawk for the number of attacks per round) and the damage each attack would do, if it hit.

So it looks like this system was used at Gen Con prior to Holmes writing the Basic Set rules. While I don't think he was at Gen Con that year, it's certainly possible he heard about, either directly or through the grapevine. It's also possible Blake learned of the system from someone else. Holmes was part of the fertile California D&D community which spawned lots of D&D variants as seen in the pages of the Alarums & Excursions zine and the Warlock and Arduin early D&D variants. I'll keep an eye out for any mention of a similar system when I look through A&E.

 

[Zenopus]

That is a breath-takingly inefficient way to spend your time preparing an adventure. You don't know in advance which encounters will happen, which will turn into fights or how long they will go on, so you need to prepare some large number of attack 'rolls' to everyone your characters might potentially run across!

Regarding how long the fights would go on, the earlier rules mention that only 10 rounds were rolled out for each monster, and then the DM just looped back to the beginning. Probably just enough that the players wouldn't catch on! Since the second time around they wouldn't necessarily be attacking the same player, the results wouldn't always be the same.

 

[Vile Traveller]

That is a breath-takingly inefficient way to spend your time preparing an adventure. You don't know in advance which encounters will happen, which will turn into fights or how long they will go on, so you need to prepare some large number of attack 'rolls' to everyone your characters might potentially run across!

These days I doubt anyone would do this by hand - there are any number of ways to generate thousands of rolls on a computer and print them out. I've done similar things in other games, it works a treat.

 

[Zenopus]

A few days ago I put up another sheet, a "Rolling Up An Adventurer" reference sheet on character generation.
Includes a bonus sheet with my take on "Swanson Abilities".

Read more & find the download link here:

Holmes Ref: Rolling up an Adventurer

zenopusarchives.blogspot.com

 

[David Johansen]

Do you know if the Dexterity and Constitution bonuses were in OD&D as well or were they just a Holmes addition?

 

[dbm]

One potential reason for the list of pre-roles: weren’t the original tournaments more competitive? This would reduce the difference between group A and group B a little to make the results more ‘comparable’.

Can’t think of many other potential benefits?

 

[Vile Traveller]

Do you know if the Dexterity and Constitution bonuses were in OD&D as well or were they just a Holmes addition?

Yes, they were in Men & Magic. Greyhawk introduced a lot more bonuses, but those didn't make it into Holmes.

 

[Gentleman Ranker]

I have a fresh question Zenopus. Apologies if it's been done to death elsewhere. How sure are we that the tower of Zenopus is outside Portown? I found the description a little ambiguous and certainly the relevant areas in the dungeon don't seem very far apart. Is it possible that Holmes was envisaging the wizards tower as within the town itself?

GR

 

[ffilz]

Yes, they were in Men & Magic. Greyhawk introduced a lot more bonuses, but those didn't make it into Holmes.

Men & Magic has a subset of the bonuses in Holmes which has a subset of the bonuses in Greyhawk.

 

[Zenopus]

Do you know if the Dexterity and Constitution bonuses were in OD&D as well or were they just a Holmes addition?

The Dexterity bonus in Holmes and on my Holmes Ref sheet is exactly the same as the one in OD&D Vol 1. The Constitution Hit Point bonus table in Holmes is the more expansive one from Greyhawk rather than the original one from OD&D Vol 1.

Yes, they were in Men & Magic. Greyhawk introduced a lot more bonuses, but those didn't make it into Holmes.

It's more of a mixed bag; Holmes did opt for the Constitution HP bonuses from Greyhawk over the one in Men & Magic. He also included the complex Intelligence table for determining Known Spells from Greyhawk (this isn't on my table because it is only for M-Us; it will instead be on a separate sheet for M-Us). The main new modifiers he did not include were the complicated Strength table, which is limited to Fighters except for penalties, and the hidden-in-the-text Dexterity bonus, also only for Fighters.

 

[Zenopus]

I have a fresh question Zenopus. Apologies if it's been done to death elsewhere. How sure are we that the tower of Zenopus is outside Portown? I found the description a little ambiguous and certainly the relevant areas in the dungeon don't seem very far apart. Is it possible that Holmes was envisaging the wizards tower as within the town itself?

The start says it is "on the low hills overlooking Portown" and near the "sea cliff west of town", which gives the impression that it is not in the town proper. But it does have "neighbors" who complain about ghost lights and the thaumaturgist's tower is just a few hundred feet away with a door "to the street outside".

From these things, I imagine it up on a hill to the west of the main part of town, but still in a location where a road leads with a few other houses on it.

I find maps of Marblehead, MA useful for visualizing the setup. Lovecraft used this town as "Kingsport" in several of his stories. See: Kingsport as Portown. The map I drew for the 5E Conversion takes its general outline from Marblehead.

 

[Gentleman Ranker]

Thanks Zenopus. I knew you'd have looked into it!

I agree that gable ends and high balconies for the captains wife to watch for his return are probably a good look for Portown!

GR

 

[Secrets of Blackmoor]

I have a couple of Holmes sets floating around. For me OD&D hits its peak in Holmes. Most of us played a mish mash of OD&D AND Holmes before AD&D in 79.

I am under the impression it is the only basic set not in PDF form at online stores.

My real question is, what would it take to get a published PDF of Holmes for those who have not seen it.

I want to share it with people, but quite honestly I would feel odd scanning and sending around copies. I also think the Holmes Estate should get a buck for each copy sold.

 

[Bunch]

I have a couple of Holmes sets floating around. For me OD&D hits its peak in Holmes. Most of us played a mish mash of OD&D AND Holmes before AD&D in 79.

I am under the impression it is the only basic set not in PDF form at online stores.

My real question is, what would it take to get a published PDF of Holmes for those who have not seen it.

I want to share it with people, but quite honestly I would feel odd scanning and sending around copies. I also think the Holmes Estate should get a buck for each copy sold.

That last sentence might be the issue. I'm sure someone could provide a top notch scan of the book. I'm not sure the family is an impediment but the question of what was the contract might be an issue. I recall from the Goodman Games B2 publication some of the early agreements were a bit too lucrative for the authors. I believe that's the reason B1 and B2 get swapped out in the Holmes edition. Can't recall which but one was earning an employee quite a bonus. I'll look when I get up to the office.

 

[Bunch]

That last sentence might be the issue. I'm sure someone could provide a top notch scan of the book. I'm not sure the family is an impediment but the question of what was the contract might be an issue. I recall from the Goodman Games B2 publication some of the early agreements were a bit too lucrative for the authors. I believe that's the reason B1 and B2 get swapped out in the Holmes edition. Can't recall which but one was earning an employee quite a bonus. I'll look when I get up to the office.

Just to update this I found the entry. Mike Carr received $0.11 per copy of B1. Including copies in the early Holmes Basic set. That apparently worked out to a significant enough payout that they swapped out B1 for B2 where he go no royalties.

 

[Zenopus]

A few points on the lack of a Holmes Basic rulebook pdf:

---There was a pdf of the rulebook for sale at one point, in one of the earlier iterations of the pdfs sales. It may have been when SVgames and/or Paizo was selling the pdfs under agreement with WOTC. I've heard it was a 3rd edition of the Holmes rulebook, and a poor scan. The scans were much poorer back then; I believe most of the items have been rescanned for the new releases.

Edit: Here's an Internet Archive Snapshot of the RPGnow page for the Holmes Basic pdf from Dec 1st, 2007. $4.95.

RPGNow.com - Wizards of the Coast - Dungeons and Dragons Basic Rulebook

web.archive.org

It says the product was added in 01/01/2001, but the oldest Internet Archive shot of the page is from 2004:

RPG Now: Dungeons and Dragons Basic Rulebook

RPG Now: Dungeons and Dragons Basic Rulebook

web.archive.org

---Chris Holmes has indicated that his father didn't get paid money for his work on the Basic Set. Gygax also referred to Holmes as a volunteer several times (once in Dragon #35). So there may not have been any sort of contract, and I don't know that he got any residuals. Although he did get copies of new TSR releases for several years.

---I also tend to think it's not an ownership issue. In addition to the earlier sales of the pdf, WOTC has also been giving away the Sample Dungeon, albeit in a poor scan, for over ten years. Furthermore, they included the Tower of Zenopus as an adventure site in Ghosts of Saltmarsh just last year. So they obviously feel they own that IP, which is the part that Holmes would have the strongest claim to.

 

[Zenopus]

My next reference sheet for Holmes Ref covers dungeon exploration:

Holmes Ref: Dungeoneering Reference Sheet

 

[Gentleman Ranker]

Hi Zenopus,

Have you looked atcovered Religion/Deities in your reviews of Holmes? I was looking at the info available and apart from Zeus, Crom & Cthulhu and the example of play "Crom's Devils!" I cant find much at all.

GR

 

[Zenopus]

Sure, someone else just asked about this on Twitter a few months ago, so I took a look at my reply there. And there's an old thread on ODD74 where member greyharp compiled setting information from Holmes' writings.

I believe you are on that board now, but I'll copy greyharp's deity list here for others to see:

Gods & Demons: Khalk'ru the Dissolver, Ozymandias, the Mi-Go, the Fungi from Yuggoth, Artaban, Asmodeus, Mithra (used a lot), Hastur, Cthulhu, Azathoth, (Church of) Saint Mellon, Gor, Thor, Odin, Crom, Hypnos, Morpheus and Ishtar.

As I wrote in a series of Twitter posts (here edited and expanded in a few instances):

Some of these were mentioned briefly and it's not clear which were used by Holmes in his own games.

In Holmes' essay "Confessions of the Dungeon Master", he describes a paladin from one of his games as "a knight of religious orders, a fighting man of the church like Sir Galahad". Later this paladin prays for divine intervention & is rescued by an angel. This shows he was using a Christian-type god in his games. This is in line with the OD&D rules (with crosses in the equipment list) and the Boinger stories (particularly the Maze of Peril), which have a Brother Ambrose, a priest who speaks Latin when casting spells, and Sir Geoffrey Haymort, Knight of the Cross.

Other deities include:

Boinger swears by Mithra at least seven times Maze of Peril.

The Amazon Hortensa refers to "Priestess of the Goddess" and "the wise ones in the Temple of the Goddess". The Amazons have a strong Greek flavor and skilled archers, so perhaps this goddess is Artemis.

The Dagonites worship Dagon, who is sculpted by them "as a tentacled being with a crested head and bulbous fish eyes, gaping shark-fanged jaws, and an expression of utter malignity". This may or may not be the same entity as Cthulhu. The other characters refer to them as "devil worshippers", further implying a belief in a Devil or devils.

And Zereth refers to the moon as a goddess: "I can feel the pull of the goddess once her silver orb clears the horizon line and floats free in the heavens".

 

[Gentleman Ranker]

Thanks for that Zenopus.

So Zeus is the only one mentioned in Holmes D&D that's not in Maze of Peril.

I wonder if the Church of Saint Mellon is the Quakers?

I'd noted that there were Crosses but no Holy Symbols in Holmes. Also, they don't appear to be needed for clerical spells or turning undead or anything specific in the rules.

I've not had access to Maze of Peril or the early Dragon stories so most of my thoughts about religion for a Holmes setting are based on the rules and on B1/B2 (and finding anything in B2 is a real stretch!)

Cheers.

GR

Edit - Just thinking about it, if Zereth refers to the moon as the goddess and the Amazons refer to the goddess, this strengthens your identification of the Amazons goddess as Artemis because she was associated with the moon in classical mythology.

 

[Voros]

A few points on the lack of a Holmes Basic rulebook pdf:

---There was a pdf of the rulebook for sale at one point, in one of the earlier iterations of the pdfs sales. It may have been when SVgames and/or Paizo was selling the pdfs under agreement with WOTC. I've heard it was a 3rd edition of the Holmes rulebook, and a poor scan. The scans were much poorer back then; I believe most of the items have been rescanned for the new releases.

Edit: Here's an Internet Archive Snapshot of the RPGnow page for the Holmes Basic pdf from Dec 1st, 2007. $4.95.

RPGNow.com - Wizards of the Coast - Dungeons and Dragons Basic Rulebook

web.archive.org

It says the product was added in 01/01/2001, but the oldest Internet Archive shot of the page is from 2004:

RPG Now: Dungeons and Dragons Basic Rulebook

RPG Now: Dungeons and Dragons Basic Rulebook

web.archive.org

---Chris Holmes has indicated that his father didn't get paid money for his work on the Basic Set. Gygax also referred to Holmes as a volunteer several times (once in Dragon #35). So there may not have been any sort of contract, and I don't know that he got any residuals. Although he did get copies of new TSR releases for several years.

---I also tend to think it's not an ownership issue. In addition to the earlier sales of the pdf, WOTC has also been giving away the Sample Dungeon, albeit in a poor scan, for over ten years. Furthermore, they included the Tower of Zenopus as an adventure site in Ghosts of Saltmarsh just last year. So they obviously feel they own that IP, which is the part that Holmes would have the strongest claim to.

That would be be craxy if Holmes didn't get paid for his work on the Basic Set. I would doubt Gygax would allow much in the way of residuals if there was no initial payment or contract.

 

[Zenopus]

Thanks for that Zenopus.

So Zeus is the only one mentioned in Holmes D&D that's not in Maze of Peril.

That's right, no Zeus. Crom is mentioned thrice; Boinger and Zereth each say "Crom's Devils!" once, and Zereth says "...by Crom!" once.
Cthulhu is not mentioned by name but Dagon is used throughout.

I wonder if the Church of Saint Mellon is the Quakers?

What is the connection between the name Mellon and the Quakers?

There is an actual Saint Mellon or Mellonius, although he seems rather obscure.

In the Boinger and Zereth stories, this one comes from "The Sorceror's Jewel" in Dragon #46, where one the characters has an uncle who is a "Patriarch of the Church of Saint Mellon". This appears to refer to the name level title from OD&D. He provides the party with cleric spell scrolls, which Zereth is able to cast (See this post for more on that).

I'd noted that there were Crosses but no Holy Symbols in Holmes. Also, they don't appear to be needed for clerical spells or turning undead or anything specific in the rules.

In the Holmes rulebook, "holy symbols" are mentioned once in the text, under the entry for Vampire (..."cross (or other holy symbol)"...), although this is not in the manuscript so it was a Gygaxian addition. This is also where the only use for them is noted.

I've not had access to Maze of Peril or the early Dragon stories so most of my thoughts about religion for a Holmes setting are based on the rules and on B1/B2 (and finding anything in B2 is a real stretch!)

I missed that your post was just referring to the Holmes rulebook; so my apologies if it was too Boinger/Zereth-specific. I'm so used to considering the broader Holmes ouevre.

As far as the rulebook goes, the section on Clerics also says "one or more of the gods", which does imply multiple gods in the setting that are available for clerical worship. This causes a bit of dissonance with the presence of only crosses on the Equipment table, and is presumably the reason for the subsequent change to "holy symbol" in the Players Handbook.

Edit - Just thinking about it, if Zereth refers to the moon as the goddess and the Amazons refer to the goddess, this strengthens your identification of the Amazons goddess as Artemis because she was associated with the moon in classical mythology.

That's a great connection!

 

[Doc Sammy]

Zenopus

What would you recommend for a game that mixes Holmes Basic with Boot Hill? I think a mix of Boot Hill 2E and Holmes Basic could make for an interesting Weird West game or something in the vein of Westworld or The Dark Tower novels.

I know Boot Hill 2E has conversion charts for Advanced D&D 1E, D&D (presumably OD&D and Basic), Gamma World, and Metamorphosis Alpha and the 1E DMG had some notes for including Boot Hill as well.

 

[Gentleman Ranker]

That's great detail. I'll certainly go back and reread the Vampire entry. I'm interested in working out what religions may be present in Portown. I found that most of my assumptions about religion in Holmes D&D were based on B1 and wanted to give it a more Dr Holmes feel. The information from Maze and the stories is a great help! Thanks.

What is the connection between the name Mellon and the Quakers?

Sorry, I was unaware of the real saint and just assumed it was a tolkien gag. "Speak Mellon and enter". Mellon is Elvish for friend and the Quakers are the Society of Friends. I assumed it was a punny name for a religion. Probably my bad sense of humour!

GR

 

[AsenRG]

Speak to me, oh Zenopus of Holmes' best sides...

...OK, that didn't sound quite as I intended it!


Anyway, my question is simple.
I've got 1234567890* games, and I don't talk just about D&D-alikes. I can do fantasy in well over two thirds in them, and probably in all of them with a bit more hacking (but in most, I just need to ignore stuff I don't need - even SF games tend to have stats for armour and magic for some almost unfathomable reason).

So why should I, in your opinion, buy and read Holmes? Outside of "because I like new games", that is! That doesn't count. (Actually, it counts as a dirty shot!)

That's the question I keep asking to many, many game authors. You're not the author, but since he isn't having an AMA here for obvious reasons, and you offered to answer any questions...


*Not really, but my notifications at Drivethru say that I've got well over 4400 "titles" awaiting me to post a review. I keep forgetting the number.

I'm impressed/depressed we rated as social media.

...NOooooOoOOOooooo!

In the American Civil War, soldiers were given the equivalent of Iron rations. It was corn meal and some grease that they would boil into little cakes to carry with them.

Sometimes they'd get standard rations, known as blue beef, which was meat that was right on the edge of being inedible.

If soldiers got lucky, they might raid a shipment of canned lobsters.

That is the 1860's. Imagine the 1200- 1500 period.

AFAIK, in the 1200-1500 period, it was worse in most places of the world, indeed.
Then again, it was reportedly better than in 1860s during the Roman times - at least with some generals )that had the smarts to care about provisions)!

Also, I've always assumed that the use of silver mirror is that it's silver. You can break it and use it to slash at an attacking werewolf! Hey, maybe the pain would cause it to fail his Morale Check!
Maybe not. But when you're first level, you take what chances you've got!

Well, it must be ~40 years since *someone* brought up caltrops in a D&D game. I guess it was his idea. Thanks for setting me straight.

IC or OOC?
OOC: Of course, those daggers need a special die for their damage...
IC: Why wouldn't you bring caltrops to a D&D games? The archers need some time to do the shooting, you know!

 

[Zenopus]

Anyway, my question is simple.
I've got 1234567890* games, and I don't talk just about D&D-alikes. I can do fantasy in well over two thirds in them, and probably in all of them with a bit more hacking (but in most, I just need to ignore stuff I don't need - even SF games tend to have stats for armour and magic for some almost unfathomable reason).

So why should I, in your opinion, buy and read Holmes? Outside of "because I like new games", that is! That doesn't count. (Actually, it counts as a dirty shot!)

That's the question I keep asking to many, many game authors. You're not the author, but since he isn't having an AMA here for obvious reasons, and you offered to answer any questions...

My apologies for the delay in responding; I wanted to think on this a bit but didn't get back here until now.

As Falconer wrote here on the OD&D forums:

I don’t think OD&D and the four Supplements are just algorithms. To me they are literature as well. That can’t be cloned.

I feel the same way about the Holmes Basic rulebook. It should be read as a particular artistic expression of an idea, not just a set of rules. Everyone should experience Holmes' breathless prose, bounding with fannish enthusiasm for the game:

"The characters are then plunged into an adventure in a
series of dungeons, tunnels, secret rooms and caverns
run by another player: the referee, often called the
Dungeon Master. The dungeons are filled with fearsome
monsters, fabulous treasure and frightful perils.
As the players engage in game after game their
characters grow in power and ability: the magic users
learn more magic spells, the thieves increase in cunning
and ability, the fighting men, hobbits, elves and
dwarves, fight with more deadly accuracy and are
harder to kill. Soon the adventurers are daring to go
deeper and deeper into the dungeons on each game,
battling more terrible monsters, and, of course,
recovering bigger and more fabulous treasure!"

It's also a historically significant book, being TSR's first attempt at clarifying the original rules and directing them to more of a general audience, and also paving the way for the D&D/AD&D split.

 

[Séadna]

Zenopus , was there ever any legal trouble with "Hobbit, Nazgul, Balrog, etc" being accidentally left in the 3rd printing of Holmes despite being expunged elsewhere or any interesting stories around that?