Let's Read the ALIEN RPG

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I have to admit, my love for Predator has grown over the years. It used to be down under a few other Arnold films, but it's pretty much at the top now with Terminator.
 
Yeah same with me, I didn't like a number of 80s action films at the time but now I appreciate the ones that seem more aware of their absurdity, like Predator and Commando, or conversely are completely unaware of their absurdity, like Cobra and Invasion USA.

One reason I think they quickly paled for me is somewhere in the early 90s I discovered HK action films and it made the fight and action scenes in US films look flat and uninspired in comparison.

I only watched Last Action Hero in the last year or so and enjoyed it a lot. I think by that point Arnold was relaxed enough to be really charming on screen.
 
Endless Flight said:
I have to admit, my love for Predator has grown over the years. It used to be down under a few other Arnold films, but it's pretty much at the top now with Terminator.
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Seriously, Alien is as much a Sci-fi classic must-see as those are. Just think of someone saying they've never seen Predator or Terminator to you. That's how we feel when you say you've never seen Alien.
 
Voros said:
Yeah same with me, I didn't like a number of 80s action films at the time but now I appreciate the ones that seem more aware of their absurdity, like Predator and Commando, or conversely are completely unaware of their absurdity, like Cobra and Invasion USA.

One reason I think they quickly paled for me is somewhere in the early 90s I discovered HK action films and it made the fight and action scenes in US films look like amateurish and flat in comparison.

I only watched Last Action Hero in the last year or so and enjoyed it a lot. I think by that point Arnold was relaxed enough to be really charming on screen.
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Heh, Predator's not even remotely in the same class of 4th-wall breaking fun that Commando is.
 
CRKrueger said:
Heh, Predator's not even remotely in the same class of 4th-wall breaking fun that Commando is.
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I enjoy Commando but it's probably behind films like Terminator 2 and Total Recall. The only thing that bugs me about the latter is that I think it looks ugly. Like the way it was filmed.
 
Endless Flight said:
I enjoy Commando but it's probably behind films like Terminator 2 and Total Recall. The only thing that bugs me about the latter is that I think it looks ugly. Like the way it was filmed.
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Yeah Commando's just an action movie, no matter how fun it is. Not really the same as Terminators and Predator.
 
Endless Flight said:
I enjoy Commando but it's probably behind films like Terminator 2 and Total Recall. The only thing that bugs me about the latter is that I think it looks ugly. Like the way it was filmed.
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Verhoeven purposefully shot his American action films with flat, TV-like lighting. That becomes even clearer when you watch his early Danish and later European films. Even Basic Instinct and Showgirls during his American period are better lit.
 
Endless Flight said:
I’ve never seen any of the Alien movies. Is the Earth an overpopulated polluted wasteland in their future?
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I just watched Alien again a few days ago and it's still great. The first half is like if someone took the best parts of Lovecraft's At the Mountains of Madness and distilled it into pure greatness. Twelve year old me decided he would join the Marine Corps after watching Aliens so you can imagine the influence it had on me :smile:
 
I'd say both Alien and Aliens (special edition/directors cut) were better movies than Predator. Not that Predator's bad, just that they're... There's more depth, more layers to the A's.
 
Alien and Aliens transcend their respective genres of horror and action to simply be great films.

As much as I love Predator, I don’t know that I’d call it a great film so much as a great action film.
 
Ok, I started watching Alien because it’s free on Prime. I’m at the 52 minute mark where they are lifting off from the planet. My thoughts so far...not very impressed. Some of the characters behaviors, and definitely actions, seem ridiculous. They just huddle around Ash while he’s operating on an alien with nary a surgical mask or any protection in sight. This is a face-sucking species they are dealing with. I know they broke the quarantine rules, but that’s crazy. I hope this improves in the second hour.
 
I finished watching it. The second hour was much improved from the first, mainly because of the scene with Ripley sneaking around with the flamethrower. I’m sure that’s an iconic scene for Alien fans. When it got down to the three crew members, I knew the other two would be dead because they made enough noise to wake the dead when they were gathering supplies or whatever they were after. The last twenty minutes was the best part of the movie for me, basically everything after the two were killed up until the end. Would I call this one of the greatest movies ever? It’s not ever going to be one of mine but I could kind of see why others would say yes. I like the atmosphere of the movie but I found some of the character actions to be nonsensical. Anyway, I gave it a shot.
 
Endless Flight said:
I finished watching it. The second hour was much improved from the first, mainly because of the scene with Ripley sneaking around with the flamethrower. I’m sure that’s an iconic scene for Alien fans. When it got down to the three crew members, I knew the other two would be dead because they made enough noise to wake the dead when they were gathering supplies or whatever they were after. The last twenty minutes was the best part of the movie for me, basically everything after the two were killed up until the end. Would I call this one of the greatest movies ever? It’s not ever going to be one of mine but I could kind of see why others would say yes. I like the atmosphere of the movie but I found some of the character actions to be nonsensical. Anyway, I gave it a shot.
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Now watch Aliens, completely different type of movie. Watch the Special Edition though.
 
Maybe in a couple weeks CRKrueger CRKrueger. I can tell if I like a movie if I want to see it again. I don’t think I’d ever watch Alien again if I had a choice. I’m wary about the sequel being that much of a difference.
 
CRKrueger said:
Now watch Aliens, completely different type of movie. Watch the Special Edition though.
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The cool thing about the original 3 Alien movies is how they all feel so much like their directors while still not feeling disjointed from each other (especially if you watch the director's cut of Alien 3).

Alien is so clearly a Ridley Scott film. Aliens is iconic James Cameron (Aliens is my favorite), Alien 3 (director's cut anyway) feels very much like David Fincher. Yet all three still feel very cohesive.

(Resurrection does feel like Whedon (though he was the writer not the director), but uh... I don't feel like Whedon worked for Alien at all. I still wonder what Resurrection would have been like if it instead felt like a Jean-Pierre Jeunet movie (the actual director)...)
 
Also it still is hard for me to fathom that him directing Alien: Resurrection falls directly between him directing The City of Lost Children and Amélie.
 
EmperorNorton said:
The cool thing about the original 3 Alien movies is how they all feel so much like their directors while still not feeling disjointed from each other (especially if you watch the director's cut of Alien 3).

Alien is so clearly a Ridley Scott film. Aliens is iconic James Cameron (Aliens is my favorite), Alien 3 (director's cut anyway) feels very much like David Fincher. Yet all three still feel very cohesive.

(Resurrection does feel like Whedon (though he was the writer not the director), but uh... I don't feel like Whedon worked for Alien at all. I still wonder what Resurrection would have been like if it instead felt like a Jean-Pierre Jeunet movie (the actual director)...)
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Heh, it’s funny.

Alien: Director’s Cut isn’t a Director’s Cut. It’s Fox having Ridley throw in all the cut scenes from the movie. There’s a reason he made cuts though having to do with tension and pacing, so he kinda recut the whole thing making it a different version of the movie. As far as Scott is concerned, the Theatrical Cut is the Director’s Cut.

Aliens: Special Edition is almost a Director’s Cut done by James Cameron and puts in scenes the Execs cut that he didn’t. It wasn’t called a Director’s Cut though, even though it’s the closest to one.

Aliens 3: The Assembly Cut isn’t a Director’s Cut either. Like Alien, Fox wanted all the cut scenes thrown in there and remastered. Fincher told them to go fuck themselves, he wanted nothing to do with it. So someone assembled and remastered the cut scenes according to his production notes. That’s why it’s called The Assembly Cut.

Alien Resurrection: Special Edition is like Aliens, it was done by the Original director. It added some scenes they couldn’t do the effects for at the time, but isn’t all the different to the Theatrical Release. Not a true Director’s Cut though.
 
Endless Flight said:
Maybe in a couple weeks CRKrueger CRKrueger. I can tell if I like a movie if I want to see it again. I don’t think I’d ever watch Alien again if I had a choice. I’m wary about the sequel being that much of a difference.
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Oh it is, believe me. It’s a James Cameron film all the way. If you liked Terminator 2, you should like Aliens.
 
Endless Flight said:
Maybe in a couple weeks CRKrueger CRKrueger. I can tell if I like a movie if I want to see it again. I don’t think I’d ever watch Alien again if I had a choice. I’m wary about the sequel being that much of a difference.
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Whether you like it or not doesn't really enter into it; Alien is a gamer pop culture essential, like Ghostbusters and The Other Guys.
 
For me Alien works just based on the acting, design, atmosphere and intensity. The script is solid but not what makes it a remarkable movie. It is a film dedicated to an overwhelming sense of dread.

I much prefer Alien to Aliens as Aliens last quarter indulges in too much Cameron silliness and sentimentality for me but if you're a fan of Terminator 2 you'll probably dig Aliens more. Personally I far prefer the gritty minimalism of Terminator to T2.

As to greatest films of all time...I prefer to break that down by genre. It is kind of nonsensical to compare, say, Dreyer's The Passion of Joan of Arc to The Shining, both are great films but in very different ways.
 
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CRKrueger said:
Aliens 3: The Assembly Cut isn’t a Director’s Cut either. Like Alien, Fox wanted all the cut scenes thrown in there and remastered. Fincher told them to go fuck themselves, he wanted nothing to do with it. So someone assembled and remastered the cut scenes according to his production notes. That’s why it’s called The Assembly Cut.
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I was aware of the stuff with the Assembly Cut (honestly couldn't remember the name of it), but I still feel like it feels more like Fincher than the original cut.

From my understanding, the reason Fincher wanted nothing to do with doing a Director's Cut was because he had a fucking awful time working with Fox.
 
Endless Flight said:
Maybe in a couple weeks CRKrueger CRKrueger. I can tell if I like a movie if I want to see it again. I don’t think I’d ever watch Alien again if I had a choice. I’m wary about the sequel being that much of a difference.
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You are in for a surprise. Aliens is probably the best example of a movie that is a great sequel but also is a classic in its own right.
 
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Skywalker said:
You are in for a surprise. Aliens is probably the best example of a movie that is a great sequel but also is a classic in its own right.
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I think of Aliens more as happening in a parallel universe in which Alien played out exactly the same as in the original.
 
Silent Green said:
Whether you like it or not doesn't really enter into it; Alien is a gamer pop culture essential, like Ghostbusters and The Other Guys.
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Well, we are on a thread about an RPG using the property. I’m aware of that. I like Ghostbusters better.
 
Voros said:
For me Alien works just based on the acting, design, atmosphere and intensity. The script is solid but not what makes it a remarkable movie. It is a film dedicated to an overwhelming sense of dread.

I much prefer Alien to Aliens as Aliens last quarter indulges in too much Cameron silliness and sentimentality for me but if you're a fan of Terminator 2 you'll probably dig Aliens more. Personally I far prefer the gritty minimalism of Terminator to T2.

As to greatest films of all time...I prefer to break that down by genre. It is kind of nonsensical to compare, say, Dreyer's The Passion of Joan of Arc to The Shining, both are great films but in very different ways.
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I agree with you about the set design on Alien. It might be the best part of the movie. I thought the acting was good. I thought Weaver and Holm were the standouts.

I liked T2 more when it came out in 1991 than I do now. I used to rank it above the original. I don’t any longer.
 
hawkeyefan said:
Alien and Aliens transcend their respective genres of horror and action to simply be great films.

As much as I love Predator, I don’t know that I’d call it a great film so much as a great action film.
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Predator is a horror film with a bunch of people who start out thinking they are in an action film.
 
Personally I think the Predator and his heat vision are scarier than anything the Alien did. When he’s chasing Arnold and he’s literally like a foot behind him and then they fall into the waterfalls is classic stuff.
 
Predator gets way too super heroey at the end for me to consider it a horror movie. The rest of it….absolutely.

But then it’s like a switch is thrown, they play a hero preparation montage, and then it loses any semblance of horror as Dutch goes toe to toe with the thing, and twigs are capable of supporting gigantic log traps, and so on.
 
Endless Flight said:
Personally I think the Predator and his heat vision are scarier than anything the Alien did. When he’s chasing Arnold and he’s literally like a foot behind him and then they fall into the waterfalls is classic stuff.
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What makes the difference for me…and perhaps this isn’t something that’d be clear unless you see more of the films…is the idea behind the creatures.

The predator is a hunter. It hunts dangerous prey. It is terrifyingly good at hunting. It collects trophies from its kills. It has an intelligence that we can understand, and uses tools and methods we can understand. While this is scary, it is understandable.

The xenomorphs are less understandable. Their motivations are less clear. We understand some of it, but there’s a lot we don’t know. Very little about them is understood. I’d elaborate a bit except I don’t want to spoil anything if you do watch the sequel.

Predator is a more specific form of scary, I think, while the xenomorphs lean more Lovecraftian or cosmic horror.
 
hawkeyefan said:
Predator gets way too super heroey at the end for me to consider it a horror movie. The rest of it….absolutely.
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The ending is a mirror of the ending of Nightmare on Elm Street, with the Final Girl (in this case Arnold) discovering the monster's weakness and setting up a bunch of improvised booby traps (in a dramatically scored montage) before the final cat-and-mouse showdown
 
TristramEvans said:
The ending is a mirror of the ending of Nightmare on Elm Street, with the Final Girl (in this case Arnold) discovering the monster's weakness and setting up a bunch of improvised booby traps (in a dramatically scored montage) before the final cat-and-mouse showdown
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No Final Girl was ever this badass...not even Ripley.
 
Late 80's John McTiernan was on point. Predator, Die Hard and The Hunt for Red October? Three of my favorites of all time. (Though most people probably don't like Red October as much as I do)
 
Silent Green said:
I think of Aliens more as happening in a parallel universe in which Alien played out exactly the same as in the original.
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:errr:
Endless Flight said:
I agree with you about the set design on Alien. It might be the best part of the movie.
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There was a good segment on Ken & Robin Talk About Stuff a few months ago about the self-destruct panel and how its builder was into Theosophy and what that implies for the setting. I'm not sure either of them have read the RPG, mind.
 
The self-destruct engagement sequence was one of my favorite scenes because it took so long to do and the alien could have jumped from behind at any moment.
 
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