I already own *all* ofTo make a gratuitous plug, if you want an organized crime game, pick up Crime Network by our ownBedrockBrendan .
I used to post over at TPB, so I have more than considered it.
BedrockBrendan's organised crime stuff and I agree it's excellent.Kinda tragic, because Mark Hunt (who I believe made the B/X &D hack, unless there's another around somewhere) really gets Gangbusters (in particular campaign, Braunstein-ish Gangbusters*) better than almost anyone I've ever heard discuss it.
So I have played very limited PbtA games (MotW and Masks) and while I thought that too I believe defenders of the system will say that is a misrepresentation of how it is supposed to be played. I’m not a big fan of PbtA and can’t really defend it but I do think it is more than a limited menu of actions players can take.
I find this take really odd. The actions are no different than stat check/skill check systems. Essentially anything that isn't covered by one of the specific actions (which thus imposes specific consequences) defaults to the take a dangerous action action, whatever that happens to be in the specific game. Some PbtA-based games get rid of almost all the actions and default most everything to stat + risky action. In neither case do the actions in any way limit what a player can declare or attempt (and players are specifically not supposed to declare the named actions, they declare what their character is specifically trying to do and the GM tells them what to roll for it).
Yes, he does but B/X is 100% the wrong system for it. I really wish they republished the limited Gangbuster rules set that was available for a while, more maybe I got that in a bad place? Anyhow the original rules were great and it deserves a retroclone and Hunt is the person to do it as he has the blessing of the author. Just make it different enough for WotC and their pinkertons to leave them alone.
What a fabulous game. I own all the things.
Mine is largely that the trope based worldbuilding frequently leads to me feeling like I'm playing in a TV Tropes page rather than a living, breathing world. It's noticable that my favourite narrative RPGs by far are Spire & Heart which take the opposite approach and go all in with worldbuilding.
Fair enough. I will freely admit to not having a good handle on the game.
Yes, while I wouldn't want to run B/X Gangbusters, I can see that Hunt clearly could design a fantastic edition with a more appropriate rule set.
To be even more fair, lots of people read PbtA games and come to the exact same conclusion. You don't really see what it's all about until you sit down and play it with someone who has at least some idea what they're doing.
Yep, the first game of Monster of the Week I played in was run by someone that had only read the books and ran it that way (pick a move). I had better experiences later with more experienced PbtA GMs but am still not a big fan of the system
Yes. My preferred GM structure is to have a solid setting full of interesting NPCs with their own agendas. I am very much a supporter of the idea of playing to see what happens, but playing to see what exists just doesn't fit well with my GM style. It's not so much a criticism of the game as it is a case of not the kind of fun I like to have as a GM. I like to have a set of playing pieces I can move around the board.
To be even fairer than you, the one time I tried running it, it was not a good group, and I don't think it was the best constructed PbtA game.
I find this actually incredibly common and probably contributes a lot to my hatred of "crap it's another PbtA game" when seeing something that looks interesting.
It is not a special problem with PbtA. The hobby and the industry struggles with many folks thinking that RPGs are like traditional games where it is played by the rules or you are cheating.
Yes normal people and families still play Monopoly and Yahtzee. We, anyone that posts here, do not qualify as ‘normal people’
If you add Beowulf Age of Heroes or even Adventures in Middle Earth 5E improves fairly drastically
I already own *all* of
Some of us can even roleplay in 4D
Hehe. Yeah I'm subbed to that Reddit and it's frustrating that though its a general RPG Reddit more often than not questions are about D&D and what someone can do with D&D. Even though there are multiple D&D focused Reddits.
In my opinion the game comes at rpgs assbackwards. It's trying to be different and to do so it basically tries to reverse everything about how you would come at a ttrpg. I totally dislike the mechanics of the system. When I and the players have to stop and think it through and make these choices that feel artificial and conflated I am not a fan. It slows the game play while your brain has to mentally translate what it wants you to do.
I'm not being facetious. PbtA can be a rough go to run for the first couple of times if you're coming from other game systems and lack any solid guidance. Running it isn't complicated at all, but that doesn't mean people don't trip like keystone cops over the actions thing. That said, the general precedent of players declaring skills checks and not actual specific actions is an awful in any system (IMO). I'll step off my soapbox now.
But you don’t declare skill checks in PbtA, you just describe what your character is doing and at some point the GM will stop you and say, “that sounds like a ____, roll your dice.”I'm not being facetious. PbtA can be a rough go to run for the first couple of times if you're coming from other game systems and lack any solid guidance. Running it isn't complicated at all, but that doesn't mean people don't trip like keystone cops over the actions thing. That said, the general precedent of players declaring skills checks and not actual specific actions is an awful in any system (IMO). I'll step off my soapbox now.
That's what I said, yeah. What the people do that bounce off PbtA is often the other thing. The idea that there are a limited number of thing you can do or actions you can declare is by a mile the most common criticism of PbtA that I've heard. I don't blame people for making that mistake, but they are certainly doing it.
*squint* is this the original SMBC comic? Or is it an edit? It seems a little too inside baseball for Weinersmith.
No idea. It showed up looking just as it does in my facebook feed.
I agree with you and largely feel the same way about the system.
This post is presented as an honest response to Rob's thought exercise request above and I would appreciate it if the Pub could refrain from taking this as yet another opportunity to dump on PbtA by refuting my points. They are reasons why it has worked _for me_. If it does not work for you then that is fine but this discussion is about why it _has_ appealed to people and grown rapidly over the last 15 years.
