Game Lines That Died Too Soon (Not RPGs)

[Zimzerveran]

As a game player and collector, I tend to get cranky when game lines I like get cancelled. Yeah, I know in the end these are usually business decisions. But, sometimes it drives me crazy when a game has lots of potential factions or expansions just peters out.

Case in point: Warhammer DiskWars from Fantasy Flight Games. After just a few expansions FFG pulled the plug on it. I loved it. It was a Warhammer minis game without having to paint an army. It had interesting mechanics, great WH art, and was priced reasonably. I suppose I was fortunate in that I was able to acquire multiple copies of the game and expansions after the line was put out to pasture. I wanted more, though!

Anyone else have game lines they wanted more from?

 

[Shipyard Locked]

The original Netrunner card game is amazing, better than many CCGs that survived the bubble burst. They resurrected it a few years ago as a living card games, and that one ALSO died too young!

Don't get me wrong, I love Magic: The Gathering and Legend of the Five Rings, but their fundamental design flaws are pretty obvious after all these decades and I sometimes wish stuff like Netrunner had been able to steal the throne.

I suppose this parallel's D&D perpetual dominance despite better RPG systems being out there.

 

[Zimzerveran]

The original Netrunner card game is amazing, better than many CCGs that survived the bubble burst. They resurrected it a few years ago as a living card games, and that one ALSO died too young!

Don't get me wrong, I love Magic: The Gathering and Legend of the Five Rings, but their fundamental design flaws are pretty obvious after all these decades and I sometimes wish stuff like Netrunner had been able to steal the throne.

I suppose this parallel's D&D perpetual dominance despite better RPG systems being out there.

I never gave Netrunner a chance after I got out of the Magic scene a long time ago. I've universally heard great things about it, though. Wait? Wasn't this also FFG?! Curse you Asmode!

It's hard to deny M:tG is the 800 lb. gorilla of thr CCG world. Much like D&D, I don't see that changing anytime soon.

 

[Self Saboteur]

Every Judge Dredd minis game.

DUST too.

 

[Raleel]

fundamental design flaws are pretty obvious after all these decades

Having stopped nearly 30 years ago (Eesh), what are some of the design flaws? I think I stopped at... antiquities? Just after unlimited

 

[Fenris-77]

Human Occupied Landfill.

 

[sharps54]

As a game player and collector, I tend to get cranky when game lines I like get cancelled. Yeah, I know in the end these are usually business decisions. But, sometimes it drives me crazy when a game has lots of potential factions or expansions just peters out.

Case in point: Warhammer DiskWars from Fantasy Flight Games. After just a few expansions FFG pulled the plug on it. I loved it. It was a Warhammer minis game without having to paint an army. It had interesting mechanics, great WH art, and was priced reasonably. I suppose I was fortunate in that I was able to acquire multiple copies of the game and expansions after the line was put out to pasture. I wanted more, though!

Anyone else have game lines they wanted more from?

The Star Trek Red Alert DiskWars game, I love that game!

 

[Zimzerveran]

The Star Trek Red Alert DiskWars game, I love that game!

I had no idea this was a thing! Looks like it was a collectible-style game. The Warhammer version was just base sets and expansions, no boosters or collecting required.

Still, I would've given it a go!

 

[sharps54]

I had no idea this was a thing! Looks like it was a collectible-style game. The Warhammer version was just base sets and expansions, no boosters or collecting required.

Still, I would've given it a go!

I came across it around when the Warhammer version came out and luckily picked up a used complete set. It’s a blast, clear the living room floor though because you need a lot of room!

 

[Jerry_B]

I'm still peeved that Star Frontiers was 'retired' too soon by an rpg with an even shorter life, Buck Rogers.

 

[chuckdee]

There have been more than a few CCGs that I've gotten into that failed. I really liked the background in Dust and The Red Star, and wish there was more supporting material for Burning Empires.

I liked GoO ASoFaI better than the current version.

 

[Toadmaster]

Decipher Lord of the Rings. I don't even care about the game that much, but it annoys me that I have The core rules, Fellowship, Two Towers but they never got to The Return of the King.

 

[sharps54]

Decipher Lord of the Rings. I don't even care about the game that much, but it annoys me that I have The core rules, Fellowship, Two Towers but they never got to The Return of the King.

I feel the same way about not getting the second Ralph Bakshi LotR film

 

[Toadmaster]

I feel the same way about not getting the second Ralph Bakshi LotR film

I feel your pain but have accepted The Hobbit (Rankin / Bass), Lord of the Rings (Bakshi) and Return of the King (Rankin / Bass) as a trilogy.

 

[TristramEvans]

I'm annoyed that Cmon's Rising Sun and Blood Rage were one and done then abandoned. But that's not exactly the same as died before their time.

First place in that category I'd give to the skirmish game Hell Dorado. Fantastic setting and art, colourful and characterful minis, and a decent set of rules. Runner up in this category is Anima Tactics.

Warmaster deserved a longer shelf life.

In the CCGs category, my choices would be X-files, killed by licensing issues before the first expansion got released, Ani-Mayhem, which lasted up to just past the CCG 90's bubble, but couldn't hold on. Also Guardians, if only for the art.

 

[Stumpydave]

I loved Adventure! As far as I know that never got anything else. ( I know there's a second ed but I'm scared to look in case they fubared the rules)

 

[Bunch]

I'm annoyed that Cmon's Rising Sun and Blood Rage were one and done then abandoned. But that's not exactly the same as died before their time.

First place in that category I'd give to the skirmish game Hell Dorado. Fantastic setting and art, colourful and characterful minis, and a decent set of rules. Runner up in this category is Anima Tactics.

Warmaster deserved a longer shelf life.

In the CCGs category, my choices would be X-files, killed by licensing issues before the first expansion got released, Ani-Mayhem, which lasted up to just past the CCG 90's bubble, but couldn't hold on. Also Guardians, if only for the art.

Blood Rage is probably the only Board game where I have all(?) The KS exclusives. I bought the base game and someone was giving away all the KS in a local Buy Nothing group.

 

[sharps54]

I feel your pain but have accepted The Hobbit (Rankin / Bass), Lord of the Rings (Bakshi) and Return of the King (Rankin / Bass) as a trilogy.

I have as well, I still prefer them to the Jackson films.

 

[AsenRG]

Can I cheat just a bit and say Streets of Fury?

Fine, fine, it's actually Skyrealms of Jorune that I came to post about...

 

[K_Peterson]

When it comes to wargaming, I get wistful thinking about AT-43. Interesting setting and factions; a pretty decent rules system.

I got into AT-43 during its last gasps of life. Online stores, like Miniature Market, were clearance-ing the hell out of the game, and I spent some cash to build up UNA and Therian armies. A few friends jumped in on the opportunity as well, and we all built up forces, ran a few demos games, and spent a few months playing through a Frostbite campaign. Great fun.

I still have all my models, but I haven't played AT-43 in about 10 years. The last time I broke them out was to use them with Xenos Rampant.

 

[David Johansen]

Alien Dungeon's Fantacide, quite a neat game by Rick Priestly, Allesio Cavatore, and Andy Chambers. I wish they'd done some full army lists for generic fantasy armies but I also wish they'd done some more of the funny / weird armies too.

Warpath 2.0 was a neat system that managed to solve the outnumbering problem alternating unit activation tends to fall into. Mantic's games have gotten more gimmicky over the years. That said, vehicle ramming was too good against smaller units. Even so, I didn't really care for where they wen't with it in the later editions.

Battlesystem 2.0 good rules, poor substructure. It desperately needed some kind of army lists and composition rules. It also needed a way to calculate points totals for characters and monsters ported in from D&D.

Silent Death it's a fun, fast paced star figher game and it deserved an rpg treatment and a ground combat game.

 

[DeadBob]

Warpath 2.0 was a neat system that managed to solve the outnumbering problem alternating unit activation tends to fall into.

What was their solution?

 

[Shipyard Locked]

Having stopped nearly 30 years ago (Eesh), what are some of the design flaws? I think I stopped at... antiquities? Just after unlimited

Speaking strictly of fundamental mechanics rather than bad specific cards or bad new mechanics (of which there are legion):

- Lands are the big one. The fact that they are crucial, single-function (mostly), and a random part of your deck makes them a lackluster resource system, leading to the dreaded mana-screws or mana-floods. What makes this worse is that there is no "backup" way to generate mana if you aren't getting the lands you need. Games like Netrunner at least let you spend actions to generate resources so you're only "in trouble" rather than "screwed". MTG has tried to mitigate this with occassional effects like cycling*, but they're really just band-aids on a fundamental problem that can never be smoothed out.

- The "stack" is the section of the MTG rules that deals with playing multiple effects that interrupt each other. It's a complicated mess that baffles new players, gets more convoluted all the time, and almost singlehandedly makes playing MTG online a chore. More on that here: https://magic.wizards.com/en/news/feature/stack-and-its-tricks-2017-11-30

- "Priority" is related to the stack and makes it worse, especially in combat situations. Just look at this: https://mtg.fandom.com/wiki/Timing_and_priority

* Example: https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/1/a/1a110be3-93ec-40ef-94a6-e4c43f1ce211.jpg?1562799744

 

[Luca]

I'm annoyed that Cmon's Rising Sun and Blood Rage were one and done then abandoned. But that's not exactly the same as died before their time.

I don't know much about Blood Rage (except the ludicrous amount of money you need to fetch those KS exclusives), but Rising Sun had several expansions published and it's pretty much as complete as it can get already? In fact it's a miracle how the expansions don't fuck up the balance of the game, I'd say publishing any more stuff would be pushing your luck way too much in whatever little shreds of unexplored design space are left to exploit.

 

[TristramEvans]

I don't know much about Blood Rage (except the ludicrous amount of money you need to fetch those KS exclusives), but Rising Sun had several expansions published and it's pretty much as complete as it can get already? In fact it's a miracle how the expansions don't fuck up the balance of the game, I'd say publishing any more stuff would be pushing your luck way too much in whatever little shreds of unexplored design space are left to exploit.

Publishing it at all past the kickstarter is what I mean. Instead of a game to be sold, it was turned into a fomo fundraiser where you either joined in or were at the mercy of what your local gamestores might have decided to go in on and the extortionists of ebay. And I did, go all in on the KS. But now years later I can't say to anyone "hey here's this great game you should try". My point was just that I think it could have had a life in retail instead of just being abandoned.

 

[David Johansen]

What was their solution?

They let you activate as many units as you liked on your turn, the first one was automatic, the second you needed a 3+ on a d6, and the rest needed a 5+. You got a re-roll within six inches of a commander. The reason it worked well, is that when you've got the numerical advantage you can afford to take risks which might let you win sooner but at the price of risking having units do nothing. It play'd very well. There was, of course, a large contingent that hated the idea that their trained troops would just sit around doing nothing.

As for the vehicles thing, they did 1d6 wounds with a -2 save modifier if they rammed a unit. I killed two units or powered armoured Enforcers and their commander in one game with a light trike.

 

[DeadBob]

That’s pretty interesting. How well did it work with a slightly outnumbering side versus a much larger ratio? Say 8 to 6 versus 10 to 4?

 

[David Johansen]

It pretty much self balances because it's a decision the player makes. You're never forced to activate multiple units.

 

[Cessna]

I had high hopes for the Starship Troopers miniatures game, but from what I heard it became completely unbalanced soon after release and disappeared.

I'd still like to play something in that setting, but when the mood strikes me I just pull out the old Avalon Hill game.

 

[David Johansen]

The movie setting or the book? FGU's Space Marines game has the book covered.

 

[Dammit Victor]

Street Fighter: the Storytelling Game.

The DragonStar campaign setting, by Fantasy Flight Games. For 3.0 D&D, never updated for 3.5 or later editions. Would've been great in any edition of D&D, Pathfinder/Starfinder, any OSR game... anything, really.

 

[sharps54]

Street Fighter: the Storytelling Game.

The DragonStar campaign setting, by Fantasy Flight Games. For 3.0 D&D, never updated for 3.5 or later editions. Would've been great in any edition of D&D, Pathfinder/Starfinder, any OSR game... anything, really.

But to be fair those are RPGs not board or miniature games, let me get us back on track.

Man o War

 

[Cessna]

The movie setting or the book? FGU's Space Marines game has the book covered.

Really, either. I like both for different reasons: the book for nostalgia, the movie for it's parody value.

(Helldivers 2 is also good for it's over the top parody.)

 

[Dammit Victor]

But to be fair those are RPGs not board or miniature games, let me get us back on track.

Man o War

Whoops. I saw the thread title and the OP, but didn't notice what category we were in.

How about He-Man and the Masters of the Universe? Either several products too few, or one too many.

 

[sharps54]

Whoops. I saw the thread title and the OP, but didn't notice what category we were in.

How about He-Man and the Masters of the Universe? Either several products too few, or one too many.

The lack of proper games, RPG or otherwise, for MotU is surprising. It is a property that should be very easy to monetize.

Yes CMON did a thing but I mean a mainstream game that is well supported and ongoing

 

[Bunch]

But to be fair those are RPGs not board or miniature games, let me get us back on track.

Man o War

I'm with you on Man o War. That and the original Adeptus Titanicus boxed game are the only GW wargames I have really played and both were a blast.

 

[sharps54]

I'm with you on Man o War. That and the original Adeptus Titanicus boxed game are the only GW wargames I have really played and both were a blast.

I can’t begin to express how disappointed I was when Dreadfleet came out and it wasn’t even the same scale.

 

[Zimzerveran]

Pocket Battles! I thought this was a great little series. Sadly, we only got four boxes: Celts vs Romans, Macedonians vs Persians, Confederacy vs Union, and Elves vs Orcs. There was a ton of possible armies for this game, but alas it wasn't meant to be. The authors were revising it and shopping it around, but nothing has come of it. I love small-format games, so I'd love to see Pocket Battles return.

 

[sharps54]

Pocket Battles!

Ha, I have a number of those sets but I don’t remember if I ever played them. Now I need to dig them out…

 

[Zimzerveran]

According to the forums for Pocket Battles at BGG, a new contract was signed in 2022. But, the game will be under a new name with probably incompatible mechanics. Radio silence since then, however.