What would you use for Veteran of the Psychic Wars?

[Imaginos]

I’ve loved BOC since I discovered them in high school. My username is directly from them. A catch line I’ve used a lot is “veteran of the psychic wars”, but what system would you use to run the psychic wars?

I’ve pondered in this and considered V&V but my enthusiasm for it wanes. I’ve thought about Psi-Wars from FGU, but it just doesn’t grab the same flavor. I’ve got GURPS and Hero System, just don’t know if that’s the bland route I want to go (only bland in the respect of it is what you make it and it is not dripping with flavor up front). Maybe OVA or BESM, but I’m waiting for my copy of OVA to ship and deliver. And that still hits the same issue as GURPS or Hero above.

I’ve thought about HeroQuest, but again flavor issue.So far the only one starting with flavor is Psi Wars. I have Psionics The Next Stage in Human Evolution but it feels more like Psi Wars above.

Any thoughts?

lyrics to the song:
You're seeing now a veteran of a thousand psychic wars,
I've been living on the edge so long, where the winds of Limbo roar.
And I'm young enough to look at,
And far old to see, all the stars are on the inside.
I'm not sure that's there's anything left to me
Don't let these shakes go on!
It's time we had a break from it,
It's time we had some leave.
We've been living in a place,
We've been eating up our brains.
Oh please don't let these shakes go on!
You ask me why I'm willing, why I can't speak to you,
You blame me for my silence, saying it's time I changed and grew.
But the wars still going on dear,
And there's no one that I know.
And I can't stand forever.
I can't say if were ever gonna be free,
Don't let these shakes go on!
It's time we had a break from it,
It's time we had some leave.
We've been living in a place,
We've been eating up our brains,
Oh please don't let these shakes go on!
You're seeing now a veteran of a thousand psychic wars,
My energy is spent at last, and my armor is destroyed,
I have used up all my weapons, and I'm helpless and bereaved.
Wounds are all I'm made of!
Did I hear you say that this is victory?
Don't let these shakes go on!
It's time we had a break from it, Send me to the rear!
Where the title madness swell,
And been sliding into Hell.
Oh please don't let these shakes go on!
Don't let these shakes go on
Don't let these shakes go on!

 

[Toadmaster]

First of all let me say your have exquisite taste in music.

No existing game really strikes me as fitting. Psi Wars is more of an underground conspiracy oriented game, that as I recall doesn't have the grungyness and pessimism that I feel would be more fitting to the BOC song.
I don't take the psychic wars part too literally. Psi obviously a component, but I imagine more of an endless war with troopers sealed in power armor vibe than atrophied bodies floating in a sensory deprivation tank.For visuals I see a Blade Runner, Alien, Outland, Rough Neck Chronicles (Starship Troopers), Starcraft kind of vibe. Personally I'd probably go with a generic system and steal from everything that strikes my fancy, I think HERO would be my preference as I am most comfortable building things with it.


For further inspiration I think these could be mined for ideas for a very metal sci fi setting, as well as a hell of a sound track. (and still no metal devil horns sign emoticon, this site is so lame ).

 

[Dumarest]

I’ve loved BOC since I discovered them in high school. My username is directly from them.

Bah! Real fans abbreviate it BÖC! Where is your umlaut?!

 

[Gabriel]

I always just interpreted the song as the lamentations of a victim of mental and emotional abuse who now has PTSD despite no visible physical scars.

 

[Imaginos]

Bah! Real fans abbreviate it BÖC! Where is your umlaut?!

im what one would call umlaut-deficient. Also known as differently alphabetical (or is it punctuational).

also, have no clue on the asci code to do it.

 

[Nobby-W]

im what one would call umlaut-deficient. Also known as differently alphabetical (or is it punctuational).

also, have no clue on the asci code to do it.

You will be able to get it off the character map app that comes with Windows, or key it with Alt-0214 off the numeric keypad.

 

[Raleel]

what does a Psychic war look like to you? then maybe we can work on a veteran

 

[Imaginos]

I always just interpreted the song as the lamentations of a victim of mental and emotional abuse who now has PTSD despite no visible physical scars.

this is definitely a valid interpretation but not something I want to game. I think mental or emotional struggles works, without defining as abuse.

First of all let me say your have exquisite taste in music.

Thank you. My first real exposure to them was picking up Imaginos on cassette.

No existing game really strikes me as fitting. Psi Wars is more of an underground conspiracy oriented game, that as I recall doesn't have the grungyness and pessimism that I feel would be more fitting to the BOC song.
I don't take the psychic wars part too literally. Psi obviously a component, but I imagine more of an endless war with troopers sealed in power armor vibe than atrophied bodies floating in a sensory deprivation tank.For visuals I see a Blade Runner, Alien, Outland, Rough Neck Chronicles (Starship Troopers), Starcraft kind of vibe. Personally I'd probably go with a generic system and steal from everything that strikes my fancy, I think HERO would be my preference as I am most comfortable building things with it.

That’s why I’m leaning toward maybe OVA, just starting to explore it though. I don’t think I can find a game that really follows through this. Hero is a great choice and I’ve enjoyed many games over the years.

I envision a lot of what you are talking about, including power armor and weapons that are powered by psionics. So the psychic energy would be a tappable resource with maybe different types of psionics being suited to different activities/weapons/equipment. Still usable to activate others, but more suited to the specific. Such as cloaking armory maybe being tied to a telepath better than a telekinetic, but the telekinetic having a better connection to a sniper rifle.

For further inspiration I think these could be mined for ideas for a very metal sci fi setting, as well as a hell of a sound track. (and still no metal devil horns sign emoticon, this site is so lame ).

All solid choices for sci fi vibe

 

[The Butcher]

This is an extraordinary coincidence; I was about to post a very similar thread, albeit with a different song from a different band.

I also second the commendations for good musical taste.

As for the OP — well, Michael Moorcock co-wrote the lyrics. So Stormbringer (or it’s RQ6 simulacrum, Mongoose’s Elric of Melniboné) for me. Though its more recent, Mythras-powered spiritual heir, Luther Arkwright, hits many of the same notes and may even allow for a more literal take on the “psychic wars” angle.

 

[Tulpa Girl]

Bah! Real fans abbreviate it BÖC! Where is your umlaut?!

Off-topic, but this reminds me of a game some of my friends would occasionally play, where they would take bands that were commonly known by their initials (BOC, ELO, ELP, BTO, etc) and come up with alternate names for those initials. My favorite was Big Orange Caterpillars.

As for a game system, because the song is forever linked in my mind to the Heavy Metal movie, I would go with something like Solar Blades & Cosmic Spells (which I haven't yet pulled the trigger on getting, but looks oh so pretty).

 

[Imaginos]

Off-topic, but this reminds me of a game some of my friends would occasionally play, where they would take bands that were commonly known by their initials (BOC, ELO, ELP, BTO, etc) and come up with alternate names for those initials. My favorite was Big Orange Caterpillars.

Sacrilege knows no bounds. ;)

As for a game system, because the song is forever linked in my mind to the Heavy Metal movie, I would go with something like Solar Blades & Cosmic Spells (which I haven't yet pulled the trigger on getting, but looks oh so pretty).

I didn’t know I needed this game until I looked it up. Thank you for the recommendation even if I don’t use it for VotPW.

(Violin on the Pungent Whistle?)

 

[Séadna]

As for a game system, because the song is forever linked in my mind to the Heavy Metal movie, I would go with something like Solar Blades & Cosmic Spells (which I haven't yet pulled the trigger on getting, but looks oh so pretty).

It's as great as you are imagining, especially the alt cover.

 

[Imaginos]

It's as great as you are imagining, especially the alt cover.

What is so great about the alternate cover?

 

[Tulpa Girl]

It's as great as you are imagining, especially the alt cover.

What is so great about the alternate cover?

And other than the cover, is there any difference between the two versions?

 

[Séadna]

What is so great about the alternate cover?

And other than the cover, is there any difference between the two versions?

Street cred!

Literally no difference at all. Just a different cover that costs an extra $20. I was enough of a sucker to fall for the off-brand Star Wars art. To be honest the normal cover is actually way more reflective of the game itself.

 

[Caesar Slaad]

As for a game system, because the song is forever linked in my mind to the Heavy Metal movie, I would go with something like Solar Blades & Cosmic Spells (which I haven't yet pulled the trigger on getting, but looks oh so pretty).

That's what I was going to say. So I'd have a tendency to run something that fits with the movie, especially the Tarna or Den sequences. Some system that does crazy science fantasy well. Not sure, Fate or Mutants & Masterminds.

The second place my mind goes is Moorcock's Eternal Champion, so Stormbringer would be a hot contender.

 

[Gringnr]

Veteran of the Psychic Wars is used in examples of character "Tells" in Over the Edge 3rd edition.

 

[Imaginos]

Veteran of the Psychic Wars is used in examples of character "Tells" in Over the Edge 3rd edition.

That's interesting. I will have to get a look at it. I've played some of Dan Davenport's pick up games using OtE but we never manage to get far into it.

 

[Gringnr]

That's interesting. I will have to get a look at it. I've played some of Dan Davenport's pick up games using OtE but we never manage to get far into it.

It's just a passing reference, might not help you much.

Peripherally related, I once played a Malkavian named Vera Gemini.

 

[Voros]

I love the idea of a psionics game but have never found a psionics rpg system that seemed ideal for its use. Meg Baker's Psi*Run is a great game but too focused and yet freeform for a longer campaign I think, a lot of others are too crunchy and although I'm a fan of 2e's Complete Psionic and Dark Sun's The Will and the Way I feel that system is too tied to D&D for use outside of it.

 

[Panzerkraken]

Any song where the writing credits go to Michael Moorcock has only one solution. It is Stormbringer. Hack it up with some Mythras or BRP.

 

[AsenRG]

Any song where the writing credits go to Michael Moorcock has only one solution. It is Stormbringer. Hack it up with some Mythras or BRP.

Mythras was myfirst idea as well, for the exact same reason.

 

[Voros]

Mythras was myfirst idea as well, for the exact same reason.

Mythras is a great choice but I'd say it is the Luther Arkwright game that is the best fit with its extensive rules for psionics, mysticism and even playing in a multiverse.

 

[Simlasa]

Yeah, Luther Arkwright makes sense... depending on your take on the song.

The second place my mind goes is Moorcock's Eternal Champion, so Stormbringer would be a hot contender.

Restating the obvious, Luther Arkwright is a take on Moorcock's Jerry Cornelius character, which is an aspect of the Eternal Champion... though Arkwright is more overtly an agent in an ongoing multiversal conflict.

 

[Raleel]

Luther Arkwright would be a great fit.

• Psychic rules where your energy can be expended
• Overarching war plot and horrific consequences
• Power armor that acts as defense against psionics
• energy weapons where your energy can be expended
• Sanity rules and dependency rules, including conditions that have the shakes (looking at you Disturbed and your nervous twitches) and silence (catanoia) and grief (melancholia) and nightmares (nightmares)
• the possibility of a thousand psychic wars because you are fighting them across multiple dimensions

 

[Toadmaster]

Off-topic, but this reminds me of a game some of my friends would occasionally play, where they would take bands that were commonly known by their initials (BOC, ELO, ELP, BTO, etc) and come up with alternate names for those initials. My favorite was Big Orange Caterpillars.

As for a game system, because the song is forever linked in my mind to the Heavy Metal movie, I would go with something like Solar Blades & Cosmic Spells (which I haven't yet pulled the trigger on getting, but looks oh so pretty).

1981 was a great year, Heavy Metal, Excalibur and the Black & Blue concert film (Black Sabbath with Blue Oyster Cult). Never heard of Solar Blades and Cosmic Spells but sounds interesting.

 

[Certified]

First, Veteran of the Psychic Wars is probably my top BOC song. Second, it probably depends on what you envision for the game. Games around psychics tend to be more conspiracy focused. Some exceptions being Psi-Punk or Trinity. Which both might work well for war stories. Then again, a reskin of Mage the Ascension could also take you in very weird directions. Other Psionic focused games like Don't rest Your Head or even Dresden Files might work well for more conspiratorial games.

Warning, self promotion ahead. There is a section in the back of Fractured Kingdom that takes about reskinning the rules for something like this. Also, I think someone was posting about their homebrew set using the rules for cults in the 1960s with awakening psychic or mystic powers. (Those posts are probably lost to the ether and fall of G+.) That said, I would probably use the rules for Metahumans Rising for something like this these days. Maybe using the Mundane Heroes option from the Beta Bullpen.

Of course, talking Metahumans Rising cracks open all the spandex locker for Hero, M&M, Icons, etc. Which brings us back around to your vision for the game. If you are looking for in the game. If you like character drama baked in Icons or Metahumans Rising might work better, if you prefer to keep these types of aspects out of character creation and game mechanics then I might look at hero or a reskinned Trinity.

Finally, this...

 

[Imaginos]

I'm really trying to nail down exactly what I want to do. I want the ability for open warfare where weapons and defenses are enhanced by the psionics. A non-psi is still viable, but the psi have an edge with certain things. But I want it to be able to play infiltration and subterfuge too. Also considering that this would have potential different settings where some might encourage open warfare and others discourage revealing your self so much. One setting would be other nations/worlds in open warfare, against other psis, or aliens, or 'monsters'. Another setting might deal with something closer to Psi-World and Psionics The Next Stage in Human Evolution, where you are fighting against an oppressive government. Maybe another setting would just be straight up espionage.

This is why I first considered the generics like GURPs or Hero, or supers like V&V. My disillusionment with V&V has come from the way attacks/defenses work, and the fact that 2 characters with flame powers attacking a force field have the same roll to hit except for their bonuses from Agility and Intelligence.

 

[Raleel]

Seriously, you should be reading Luther Arkwright.

• Weapons and armor that helps psionics. Even a vehicle.
• everyone gets a talent, and psionics is a talent, but not everyone gets psionics. You might have eidetic memory or know all your parallel selves.
• infiltration absolutely can happen.
• the parallels in Luther Arkwright are literally other settings. Want to have the war in revolutionary america? It’s there. In futuristic dystopia where the war is nearly lost? It’s there.

here’s a snippet about the primary adversary.
The Disruptors

The Disruptors emerged from a millennia-long, galaxy-spanning civil war that saw the being known as the Omega survive. This being, a carbon based analogue to W.O.T.A.N, seeks to sow chaos and destroy the parallels for a reason known only to itself. It uses the Disruptors to modify and subvert human progress across the parallels for its own ends.

Their origins are shrouded in mystery, but it is known that the Disruptors operate from a hidden base on a parallel unknown to W.O.T.A.N They have also been manipulating the course of human events for much longer than the Valhalla Program has been acting against Disruptor influence.

and about the good guys.
W.O.T.A.N, the massive supercomputer on Parallel Zero-Zero tracks instabilities across the parallels and helps guide Zero-Zero through computational analysis, is the latest evolution of Marx’s discoveries. However, W.O.T.A.N can’t work alone. It needs a dedicated group of men and women to interpret the results, maintain the data warehouses and arrays, and take action when it’s needed. These brave scientists, technicians, and operators are part of the Valhalla Program.

your flame power people, in Mythras (the system under Luther Arkwright) could have different combat styles traits depending on what they looked like. They also could choose different special effects if they were available.

 

[ReluctantGM]

In other news, BOC has a brand new album that has just been released: http://www.blueoystercult.com/

The teaser tracks I've heard are really good!

 

[Imaginos]

Seriously, you should be reading Luther Arkwright.
...
your flame power people, in Mythras (the system under Luther Arkwright) could have different combat styles traits depending on what they looked like. They also could choose different special effects if they were available.

My group played Legend for a while. How close is Mythras to still being Legend? I recall not enjoying the magic in Legend much, so is Mythras with psionics just running like Legend magic?

In other news, BOC has a brand new album that has just been released: http://www.blueoystercult.com/

The teaser tracks I've heard are really good!

I was listening to it last night. They have the full album available on Youtube.

 

[Imaginos]

Jumping in to apologize for the incorrect lyrics posted in the first post. I just read through them and note a few errors. Who would’ve thought that copying and pasting from a lyric site would give the wrong lyrics.

A couple of notable changes:
You see me now a veteran...
all the scars are on the inside...

Sadly I cannot edit the first post nor copy and paste the correct lyrics from the genius website here.

 

[Raleel]

My group played Legend for a while. How close is Mythras to still being Legend? I recall not enjoying the magic in Legend much, so is Mythras with psionics just running like Legend magic?

Without knowing what they didn't enjoy about Legend magic, I don't think I can address it directly.

Primary differences between legend and mythras

• less numeric bonuses across the board. Where they do happen, Mythras uses a percentage of your skill system by default (1/3, 1/2, 10%, 150%, etc). It also has a table to do a flat bonus increase like Legend, but there are virtually no +5% or +10% bonuses explicitly called out.
• Cultures and careers are laid out a bit different. Legend would give you a bonus to a skill for a culture, mythras gives you access to the skill (though some skills it says "you have to pick from this for these points (then later you can put in other points").
• No heroic ability/feat things, though most every ability has been mapped somehow into a magic system somewhere, or shows up as a gift.

In the case of Luther Arkwright, the psionics system is a simpler magic system. A single skill, your own points, with the various psionic talents (aka powers) broken up into disciplines (aka schools). it is somewhat like Legend's Common Magic in mechanics (single skill roll), but notable difference in casting time (single action for psionics, potentially more for Legend Common Magic). Power Levels are probably not that different, but I think that psionics are a bit more powerful - a psychic wrack is pulling d6 to a single target in line of sight at 61% skill for 1 magic point, while a disruption is pulling d3 at upwards of 100m

Luther Arkwright also has Mysticism, which is not present at all in Legend. This is a wuxia/jedi/ninja sort of magic, where you are boosting skills and blocking arrows and the like.

Luther Arkwright characters may also have a trait (or two). Things like being forgettable or charming or assimilating information quickly or broadcasting pain or being immune to psionics or healing faster.

 

[Imaginos]

I don’t recall specifically what I didn’t like about the magic in Legend. It has been years since we played it. Just ordered a copy of Luther Arkwright.

 

[Korgoth]

Whenever I hear that song and especially the first line " You're seeing now a veteran of a thousand psychic wars..." It always made me think of this 3 page section from the HERO 4E Ultimate Mentalist book. Or maybe the reverse when I first read that section it made me think of the song.

Though it's short, only 3 pages in length, it really stuck with me and made me think about what exactly would a future war be like with soldiers who had telepathy, esp, pregognition, etc. Wether it be ESPer vs ESPer, or worse (for those without powers) fighting against such commandoes. In the Traveller setting Zhodani Psionic Commandoes would be hell to fight against I'd imagine.

Pages 95,96 and 97 of the book for those that own it.

 

[Imaginos]

Luther Arkwright arrived yesterday. Now I have to dig into this. I admit I was surprised it was hardcover.

 

[Imaginos]

Just reacquired Alternity this week as memory seems to serve that it might be an option too.

 

[Vidgrip]

You might get some ideas from Nightshift: Veterans of the Supernatural War. It happens to be on sale right now at Drivethru: https://www.drivethrurpg.com/product/308014/Night-Shift-Veterans-of-the-Supernatural-Wars
The game contains a few possible settings, one of which is a post-apocalyptic world with super science, magic, and psychic powers that sounds a lot like Hellgate London.