Who is the most influential living game designer?

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chuckdee said:
Not just a bunch of the games, but the system is his (as I found out when I was trying to license it) and ORE is his also.
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I was under the impression ORE was Greg Stolze? (Godlike, Reign, Wild Talents, A Dirty World, Better Angels, Wild Talents)
 
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SavAce said:
I was under the impression ORE was Greg Stolze? (Godlike, Reign, Wild Talents, A Dirty World, Better Angels, Wild Talents)
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ORE is definitely Greg Stoltze, writing-wise anyway. I'm pretty sure he owns it as well though.
 
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Fenris-77 said:
ORE is definitely Greg Stoltze, writing-wise anyway. I'm pretty sure he owns it as well though.
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When I talked to them about licensing it, they had to check with Robin Laws from my recollection. Though I might be recalling incorrectly.
 
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Ron Edwards deserves special mention, I guess. Not the most influential, but definitely in the top five or so. And not just for Champions Now.
 
In terms of positive influence, Jackson & (especially) Livingstone in the UK are obvious, though their genius is as much as businessmen, founders of Games Workshop, as creators of Fighting Fantasy.

I think Mike Pondsmith might be the most positively influential US designer outside the fantasy genre. Because he's black I have to double-check that I'm not falling victim to the Mary Seacole Effect, where a black person becomes renowned far beyond their actual importance (to the extent that UK schoolkids now think Seacole was far more important than Florence Nightingale, who revolutionised nursing care). But from everything I can tell, I believe Pondsmith has earned his position purely on merit.
 
Mangoplum said:
I think he's had a big influence, though probably NOT by way of the games he designed (though I think Sorcerer had some nifty ideas).
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Yeah you've hit the nub of what I was getting at. He shepherded a new generation of funky designers and directed their talents in new and interesting ways. Never read a game of his I actually loved, apart from Trollbabe, but his influence is writ large through the 21st century rpg hobby.
 
S'mon said:
In terms of positive influence, Jackson & (especially) Livingstone in the UK are obvious, though their genius is as much as businessmen, founders of Games Workshop, as creators of Fighting Fantasy.

I think Mike Pondsmith might be the most positively influential US designer outside the fantasy genre. Because he's black I have to double-check that I'm not falling victim to the Mary Seacole Effect, where a black person becomes renowned far beyond their actual importance (to the extent that UK schoolkids now think Seacole was far more important than Florence Nightingale, who revolutionised nursing care). But from everything I can tell, I believe Pondsmith has earned his position purely on merit.
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The belated (and, honestly, surprising) success and exposure of Cyberpunk due to the video game and anime series has been a big help to his reputation. Ten years ago bringing him up in this context would’ve generated a lot of lols and snark about the action figure art in Cyberpunk 3.0, but now people can point to the video game and anime (and revival in the fortunes of RTG afforded by the cash infusions from those) and he looks like a much more important and resilient figure.
 
So I’ve been reading through the thread and there are several for which you can make a good argument.

But I’m gonna throw a name out there that I haven’t seen mentioned yet, but whose influence is huge, though I’m not crazy about it, and it may not immediately be obvious.

Tracy Hickman.

The main force behind the adventure path model that dominates the hobby to this day.
 
hawkeyefan said:
Tracy Hickman.

The main force behind the adventure path model that dominates the hobby to this day.
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"Dear Fellow Villagers

We will be meeting in the town square at 11:30pm SHARP! Please bring your own pitchforks, torches, hatchets and broken bottles. Ale, wine and stronger spirits will be provided by the most generous Innkeeper Brown and Father Killemall. After the Father works us up into a frenzied mob, the march toward Hickman Castle will commence. We're thinking the burning and pillaging will be finished by 12.30am.

Please make provisions for finding your own way back to the village,

Yours Faithfully

Mayor Fuckhickman"
 
T. Foster said:
Remember with Sandy Petersen that in addition to writing Call of Cthulhu he also co-wrote (with Greg Stafford and Lynn Willis - both now deceased) the Ghostbusters rpg, whose system was lifted and expanded into the WEG Star Wars D6 system which was VERY influential on other 90s-era games like Shadowrun and Vampire (basically anything that uses dice pool resolution and prioritizes cinematic “rule of cool” logic over straight simulation). He also was Greg’s close collaborator on Glorantha in the 80s, co-writing several classic products like Trollpak and the Glorantha boxed set that still forms most of the spine of that setting, and after leaving rpgs went to work for iD Studios where he was part of the creative team behind Doom and Quake, and was also big in the LARP scene.

He’s probably my #1 choice, alongside Miller, Chadwick, Pondsmith, Costikyan, and (begrudgingly because I don’t particularly like their games) Tweet and Rein-dot-Hagen.
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I was thinking Sandy Peterson's Ghostbuster/dice pool mechanics contribution hadn't been given the attention it deserves so kudos for that. Extra points for Rein-dot-Hagen it took me a few seconds as it had been a while since I read any V:tM but I got it.

My three finalists in no particular order:

Sandy Peterson (see above) influential on BRP and dice pool mechanics. Fingers in many pies and decades of influence seeping through.

Vincent and Meguey Baker - I had a break from the hobby for a long time in the early part of the century so maybe I missed the stepping stones like Fate but reading Apocalypse World for the first time felt like the most mind blowing experience (success with complications!, playbooks!, moves! Sex moves....er OK maybe not that one) even if it wasn't all new new it put it in a format that got people's attention and influenced them. Of course it wasn't just the mechanics or narrative style or play to find out it was the letting other people use/hack the system as they saw fit. Number one RPG on kick starter ever? Avatar legends, what system does it use? PbtA.

Jonathan Tweet - for his work on 3e which influenced the action economy genre of D&D and post D&D games D20, Pathfinder, 5e and the splurge of ORC license games about to hit which make up most of the hobby in sales numbers plus for the rest of his work and other games he worked on -13th age Ars Magica, Everyway etc which I think pushes him ahead of Monte Cook et al)

Honourable mentions:

John Harper - Blades in the Dark of course takes a lot of DNA from Apocalypse World so points to the Bakers and has a large influence through other Forged in the Dark games but also this is the guy who wrote Lazers and Feelings and World of Dungeons. It has been scientifically proven that 37% of all super rules light, one page RPGs on itch.io have a John Harper game as a direct descendant. Whether you view this as a good thing or not is up to you.

Mark Rein-Hagen - WoD was such a huge shake up when Vampire came out. (Dice pool system CF Sandy Peterson natch) It was literally one week Orcs and Elves are cool then "what's this Vampire business?" And the next week - Orcs and Elves are so lame! D&D is old hat now. Feel my pain while I ponder my humanity and wear a trenchcoat and listen to the Manic Street Preachers first album on repeat.
In terms of setting, popularising urban fantasy as a genre outside the 1920s, use of metaplots, music lyric quotes in your rulebook, actual real girls wanting to play, there is a huge lasting effect from Vampire even if White Wolf lost the plot. Plus he co wrote Ars Magica with Jonathan Tweet and wrote his name with a dot instead of a hyphen!

Monte Cook - same reasons as Jonathan Tweet but his outside of D&D work isn't as varied I personally feel other may differ and offer to fight me over it.

Chris McDowell - cheating a bit as probably my favourite designer but the number of OSR games that either directly claim to be from the Odd like Cairn or Mausritter or just have taken on aspects of into the Odd or Electric Bastionland indirectly seem to keep growing. Seems to have been a major trigger for the non retro clone OSR and his game running advice I think seeps through into many rules light play fast games. I suspect he'll end up being the Velvet Underground of designers didn't sell a huge number of copies but everyone who bought one went off to design or hack their own game.

EDIT: forgot to add Jackson/Livingstone for promoting RPGs in the UK and Tracy Hickman for the old school to Trad shift but my wife was badgering me for popcorn so I forgot.
 
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hawkeyefan said:
So I’ve been reading through the thread and there are several for which you can make a good argument.

But I’m gonna throw a name out there that I haven’t seen mentioned yet, but whose influence is huge, though I’m not crazy about it, and it may not immediately be obvious.

Tracy Hickman.

The main force behind the adventure path model that dominates the hobby to this day.
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Yeah. I know he meant well, but.... well I suppose on the bright side, without Hickman, there'd be no OSR! :grin:
 
Baulderstone said:
It's definitely Greg. I was in a gaming group with him when he was designing it.
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Just to add to this on the topic of influences: Greg was doing freelance work for World of Darkness at the time. He was frustrated that you were rolling so many dice and extracting so little information from them. ORE was the result.
 
Baulderstone said:
Just to add to this on the topic of influences: Greg was doing freelance work for World of Darkness at the time. He was frustrated that you were rolling so many dice and extracting so little information from them. ORE was the result.
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I've never played ORE. I thought it sounded pretty great when I first read it's dice mechanism, and the settings implementing it were cool. Later on, doubt began to creep in and I saw a string of critiques of the system's quirks, taking a bit of shiny off its shiny new thing.
I'd still like to try it, just to see it run.
 
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Mangoplum said:
I've never played ORE. I thought it sounded pretty great when I first read it's dice mechanism, and the settings implementing it were cool. Later on, doubt began to creep in and I saw a string of critiques of the system's quirks, taking a bit of shiny off its shiny new thing.
I'd still like to try it, just to see it run.
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This might not be typical experience, but I've found Reign, the fantasy ORE, to be great for pick-up games and 1-3 session micro-campaigns.
 
Mangoplum said:
I've never played ORE. I thought it sounded pretty great when I first read it's dice mechanism, and the settings implementing it were cool. Later on, doubt began to creep in and I saw a string of critiques of the system's quirks, taking a bit of shiny off its shiny new thing.
I'd still like to try it, just to see it run.
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My main criticism of ORE, especially in its crunchier variants, is that it's deceptively simple. It didn't click for me until I'd achieved enough familiarity to do the core rules instinctively.
 
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Ron's a weird one because I'd agree he's influential, but it's not for any of the games he's designed. He's an influential theorist. (Same as Jon Peterson has done a lot for our understanding of RPG history and Lee Gold's influence on the formation of the first RPG community is often overlooked. But neither of them are famous designers).

On the other hand, another argument for the inclusion of the Bakers is that "sex moves" made a big impression on other designers, especially TristramEvans TristramEvans who thinks about them every day.
 
A Fiery Flying Roll said:
Ron's a weird one because I'd agree he's influential, but it's not for any of the games he's designed. He's an influential theorist. (Same as Jon Peterson has done a lot for our understanding of RPG history and Lee Gold's influence on the formation of the first RPG community is often overlooked. But neither of them are famous designers).

On the other hand, another argument for the inclusion of the Bakers is that "sex moves" made a big impression on other designers, especially TristramEvans TristramEvans who thinks about them every day.
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All of the solo gaming I do is 100% sex moves.
 
A Fiery Flying Roll said:
Ron's a weird one because I'd agree he's influential, but it's not for any of the games he's designed. He's an influential theorist. (Same as Jon Peterson has done a lot for our understanding of RPG history and Lee Gold's influence on the formation of the first RPG community is often overlooked. But neither of them are famous designers).
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Ron has been very influential on a different hobby from RPGs; arguing about RPGs online


A Fiery Flying Roll said:
On the other hand, another argument for the inclusion of the Bakers is that "sex moves" made a big impression on other designers, especially TristramEvans TristramEvans who thinks about them every day.
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making a ccg about them
 
A Fiery Flying Roll said:
It's definitely functional as a game. (Pundy can use that as a pull quote if he wants. Lion and Dragon - Definitely functional).
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And historically accurate in that all us Scotsfolk worship "The Hawk". I'm sure you've noticed that since you moved up north. All us Scotsfolk, Hawking all over the place. Love a good Hawk, we do.
 
JAMUMU said:
And historically accurate in that all us Scotsfolk worship "The Hawk". I'm sure you've noticed that since you moved up north. All us Scotsfolk, Hawking all over the place. Love a good Hawk, we do.
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And you never get sick, what with your minimum CON requirement.
 
A Fiery Flying Roll said:
And you never get sick, what with your minimum CON requirement.
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's why we smoke and drink so much. Fkn invulnerable we are.

Jennifer's got the right of it. Between "all the french are literal frogs" and "all scots are berserker hardfolk with minimum CON and the Hawk in their corner" I imagine that living in Venezuela is a cover, and he really resides in a high-rise in Castlemilk.
 
S'mon said:
Yeah. I know he meant well, but.... well I suppose on the bright side, without Hickman, there'd be no OSR! :grin:
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That’s a big part of his influence. The two significant recent movements in the hobby were largely a response to the kind of gaming Hickman helped make popular. And the mainstream continues to largely follow his model to this day.

Everything that’s come out of the OSR can be considered a response to Hickman. Everything that came from or was influenced by the Forge was a response to Hickman (and Rein-Hagen).

Considering the amount of RPG output he actually had, his influence is monstrous.
 
hawkeyefan said:
That’s a big part of his influence. The two significant recent movements in the hobby were largely a response to the kind of gaming Hickman helped make popular. And the mainstream continues to largely follow his model to this day.

Everything that’s come out of the OSR can be considered a response to Hickman. Everything that came from or was influenced by the Forge was a response to Hickman (and Rein-Hagen).

Considering the amount of RPG output he actually had, his influence is monstrous.
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So what you're saying is "Die, Hickman, Die!" is a legitimate idea for a scenario?
 
JAMUMU said:
So what you're saying is "Die, Hickman, Die!" is a legitimate idea for a scenario?
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It’s too late barring time travel!

I mean, I don’t bear the guy any ill will…he seems like a nice enough guy.

But GM-as-author is doo doo.
 
hawkeyefan said:
But GM-as-author is doo doo.
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As is Player-as-author (IMO).

A Fiery Flying Roll said:
My main criticism of OSR, especially in its crunchier variants, is that it's deceptively simple. It didn't click for me until I'd achieved enough familiarity to do the core rules instinctively.
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By saying it's 'deceptively simple' do you mean that it's NOT as simple as it first appears? It has hidden complexities?
 
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